[Patrick Turner]

OK, who has a Hoover 800 series washing machine schematic?

My old machine is a 1978 top loader and listed as 820, 830, 835
or just 800 series..
Searches didn't yield much,
and trying to work out the schematic of the
timer control with 60 position switch and the control unit
with 20 wire connections, one or two of which may be incorrect
is not easy.

Its a tough old machine, but the ****in Hoover timer control module
has failed 4 times since 1978, but all else seems to test OK.

The local parts supplier has most parts still but
of course does not have the workshop service manual.

And the machine didn't fail because I tried to wash the dirt from the
acrimonius postings here. One would think it would have.

Just random tiredness of something old, that should have lasted longer.

Patrick Turner.

[Peter Wieck]

On Mar 5, 7:25*am, Patrick Turner wrote:
OK, who has a Hoover 800 series washing machine schematic?

My old machine is a 1978 top loader and listed as 820, 830, 835
or just 800 series..
Searches didn't yield much,
and trying to work out the schematic of the
timer control with 60 position switch and the control unit
with 20 wire connections, one or two of which may be incorrect
is not easy.

Its a tough old machine, but the ****in Hoover timer control module
has failed 4 times since 1978, but all else seems to test OK.

The local parts supplier has most parts still but
of course does not have the workshop service manual.

And the machine didn't fail because I tried to wash the dirt from the
acrimonius postings here. One would think it would have.

Just random tiredness of something old, that should have lasted longer.

Patrick Turner.

Have you tried:

sci.*electronics.*repair?

That venue has sources on the most obscure stuff, including laundry
and kitchen appliances.

Alternately, if you wish, I could call the company HQ here in the US
if you have a serial number and exact model number (there should be a
nameplate somewhere?). I am sure it was not made here, but who knows?

Good luck with it. I have always found it difficult to throw away many
kilos of steel and enamel for a $4 part. May it last you forever.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[Patrick Turner]

Peter Wieck wrote:

On Mar 5, 7:25 am, Patrick Turner wrote:
OK, who has a Hoover 800 series washing machine schematic?

My old machine is a 1978 top loader and listed as 820, 830, 835
or just 800 series..
Searches didn't yield much,
and trying to work out the schematic of the
timer control with 60 position switch and the control unit
with 20 wire connections, one or two of which may be incorrect
is not easy.

Its a tough old machine, but the ****in Hoover timer control module
has failed 4 times since 1978, but all else seems to test OK.

The local parts supplier has most parts still but
of course does not have the workshop service manual.

And the machine didn't fail because I tried to wash the dirt from the
acrimonius postings here. One would think it would have.

Just random tiredness of something old, that should have lasted longer.

Patrick Turner.

Have you tried:

sci.*electronics.*repair?

That venue has sources on the most obscure stuff, including laundry
and kitchen appliances.

Alternately, if you wish, I could call the company HQ here in the US
if you have a serial number and exact model number (there should be a
nameplate somewhere?). I am sure it was not made here, but who knows?

Good luck with it. I have always found it difficult to throw away many
kilos of steel and enamel for a $4 part. May it last you forever.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote,

I've emailed Hoover on their so called support form online
and maybe I get a response, but the online support
is done in a typical poor manner to NOT be easy to use,
and I bet Hoover want me to buy a new washer rather than fix the old
one.

If there isn't a an email response by tommorrow, I'll phone the
tech support line they have but they charge over 2 ****in dollars per
****in minute.

I'm gonna ask for a schematic, and I bet I don't get a result.


I hate replacing gear that's 99% OK and in want of a small fix only.

Hoover is a typical bunch of Aholes for not providing online
schematics for the models made in the long distant past.

They'd disagree with me of course......

But never ever buy anything without a workshop manual, BIG mistake.

The local Mr Fix it men who do repairs are always out for a big $$
and they know what's wrong but then dress up the cost of repairs.

Its like a dodgy amp repair guy who says there is a bad OPT, but its an
open resistor,
so the customer forks out bigtime for OPT, the guy changes a resistor,
customer is fooled, and the rip happens.

Repairists of just about everything often try to pull the wool over
customers.

So I always avoid tradesmen visiting me for a fix because of the cost
and reputation they have, and I don't earn what they get.

If I earned ordinary wages I could occasionally afford to hire a
mechanic, plumber,
electrician, painter, appliance repair guy, but I know what they charge,
and its just not on.

For awhile I'll wash in the laundry tub by hand.

I don't mind the exertion.
Good way to further develop upper body structure.

But my female house companion is a bit worried.....

What's the definition of FRUSTRATED?

A sheila without a washing machine.

Patrick Turner.

[Peter Wieck]

On Mar 6, 3:09*am, Patrick Turner wrote:
Peter Wieck wrote:

On Mar 5, 7:25 am, Patrick Turner wrote:
OK, who has a Hoover 800 series washing machine schematic?

My old machine is a 1978 top loader and listed as 820, 830, 835
or just 800 series..
Searches didn't yield much,
and trying to work out the schematic of the
timer control with 60 position switch and the control unit
with 20 wire connections, one or two of which may be incorrect
is not easy.

Its a tough old machine, but the ****in Hoover timer control module
has failed 4 times since 1978, but all else seems to test OK.

The local parts supplier has most parts still but
of course does not have the workshop service manual.

And the machine didn't fail because I tried to wash the dirt from the
acrimonius postings here. One would think it would have.

Just random tiredness of something old, that should have lasted longer..

Patrick Turner.

Have you tried:

sci.*electronics.*repair?

That venue has sources on the most obscure stuff, including laundry
and kitchen appliances.

Alternately, if you wish, I could call the company HQ here in the US
if you have a serial number and exact model number (there should be a
nameplate somewhere?). I am sure it was not made here, but who knows?

Good luck with it. I have always found it difficult to throw away many
kilos of steel and enamel for a $4 part. May it last you forever.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote,

I've emailed Hoover on their so called support form online
and maybe I get a response, but the online support
is done in a typical poor manner to NOT be easy to use,
and I bet Hoover want me to buy a new washer rather than fix the old
one.

If there isn't a an email response by tommorrow, I'll phone the
tech support line they have but they charge over 2 ****in dollars per
****in minute.

I'm gonna ask for a schematic, and I bet I don't get a result.

I hate replacing gear that's 99% OK and in want of a small fix only.

Hoover is a typical bunch of Aholes for not providing online
schematics for the models made in the long distant past.

They'd disagree with me of course......

But never ever buy anything without a workshop manual, BIG mistake.

The local Mr Fix it men who do repairs are always out for a big $$
and they know what's wrong but then dress up the cost of repairs.

Its like a dodgy amp repair guy who says there is a bad OPT, but its an
open resistor,
so the customer forks out bigtime for OPT, the guy changes a resistor,
customer is fooled, and the rip happens.

Repairists of just about everything often try to pull the wool over
customers.

So I always avoid tradesmen visiting me for a fix because of the cost
and reputation they have, and I don't earn what they get.

If I earned ordinary wages I could occasionally afford to hire a
mechanic, plumber,
electrician, painter, appliance repair guy, but I know what they charge,
and its just not on.

For awhile I'll wash in the laundry tub by hand.

I don't mind the exertion.
Good way to further develop upper body structure.

But my female house companion is a bit worried.....

What's the definition of FRUSTRATED?

A sheila without a washing machine.

Patrick Turner.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Well, if you give me a serial number and whatever part number/model
number is on the nameplate, I will try getting in touch with Hoover HQ
in Glenwillow, Ohio. It is a strange phenomenon, but some old-line US
companies are starting to get the message that if they do not coddle
their customers there is actually competition out there. Often too
little, too late, but it is refreshing after so many years of
ignorance on their part.

Again, good luck.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[Patrick Turner]

Peter Wieck wrote:

On Mar 6, 3:09 am, Patrick Turner wrote:
Peter Wieck wrote:

On Mar 5, 7:25 am, Patrick Turner wrote:
OK, who has a Hoover 800 series washing machine schematic?

My old machine is a 1978 top loader and listed as 820, 830, 835
or just 800 series..
Searches didn't yield much,
and trying to work out the schematic of the
timer control with 60 position switch and the control unit
with 20 wire connections, one or two of which may be incorrect
is not easy.

Its a tough old machine, but the ****in Hoover timer control module
has failed 4 times since 1978, but all else seems to test OK.

The local parts supplier has most parts still but
of course does not have the workshop service manual.

And the machine didn't fail because I tried to wash the dirt from the
acrimonius postings here. One would think it would have.

Just random tiredness of something old, that should have lasted longer.

Patrick Turner.

Have you tried:

sci.*electronics.*repair?

That venue has sources on the most obscure stuff, including laundry
and kitchen appliances.

Alternately, if you wish, I could call the company HQ here in the US
if you have a serial number and exact model number (there should be a
nameplate somewhere?). I am sure it was not made here, but who knows?

Good luck with it. I have always found it difficult to throw away many
kilos of steel and enamel for a $4 part. May it last you forever.

Peter Wieck
Wyncote,

I've emailed Hoover on their so called support form online
and maybe I get a response, but the online support
is done in a typical poor manner to NOT be easy to use,
and I bet Hoover want me to buy a new washer rather than fix the old
one.

If there isn't a an email response by tommorrow, I'll phone the
tech support line they have but they charge over 2 ****in dollars per
****in minute.

I'm gonna ask for a schematic, and I bet I don't get a result.

I hate replacing gear that's 99% OK and in want of a small fix only.

Hoover is a typical bunch of Aholes for not providing online
schematics for the models made in the long distant past.

They'd disagree with me of course......

But never ever buy anything without a workshop manual, BIG mistake.

The local Mr Fix it men who do repairs are always out for a big $$
and they know what's wrong but then dress up the cost of repairs.

Its like a dodgy amp repair guy who says there is a bad OPT, but its an
open resistor,
so the customer forks out bigtime for OPT, the guy changes a resistor,
customer is fooled, and the rip happens.

Repairists of just about everything often try to pull the wool over
customers.

So I always avoid tradesmen visiting me for a fix because of the cost
and reputation they have, and I don't earn what they get.

If I earned ordinary wages I could occasionally afford to hire a
mechanic, plumber,
electrician, painter, appliance repair guy, but I know what they charge,
and its just not on.

For awhile I'll wash in the laundry tub by hand.

I don't mind the exertion.
Good way to further develop upper body structure.

But my female house companion is a bit worried.....

What's the definition of FRUSTRATED?

A sheila without a washing machine.

Patrick Turner.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Well, if you give me a serial number and whatever part number/model
number is on the nameplate, I will try getting in touch with Hoover HQ
in Glenwillow, Ohio. It is a strange phenomenon, but some old-line US
companies are starting to get the message that if they do not coddle
their customers there is actually competition out there. Often too
little, too late, but it is refreshing after so many years of
ignorance on their part.

Again, good luck.

I'm sure my email from their website form went to the
parent company, and perhaps they wouldn't care about
the Oz production of Hoover that existed 30 years ago.

Oz has 240V, and Hoover stoves and washers etc were made here,
but ppl tell me electrolux took the Oz Hoover branch over...

Models made in the US would be different to those made here
because of the voltage. Maybe they looked the same,
but there would be internal differences to suit 240V.

Possibly Hoover had factories in the UK and europe...
where the voltage is nearly the same as ours.

I'll ring the service number tomorrow...

Patrick Turner.



Peter Wieck
Wyncote, PA

[Iain Churches[_2_]]

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...

Possibly Hoover had factories in the UK and europe...
where the voltage is nearly the same as ours.


Indeed they did. There was a huge factory on
Western Avenue at Greenford near Acton London W.
I am sure this was not the only one in the UK

Even then, their products were considered as
pretty poor (your machine seems to have lasted
well:-)

AEG, Bosch, and Miele have a much better
reputation. We have a Miele tower (washer and
condenser tumble drier on the top) which has
been in daily use since 1984) Still going strong!

[Eeyore]

Iain Churches wrote:

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message

Possibly Hoover had factories in the UK and europe...
where the voltage is nearly the same as ours.

Indeed they did. There was a huge factory on
Western Avenue at Greenford near Acton London W.
I am sure this was not the only one in the UK

Even then, their products were considered as
pretty poor (your machine seems to have lasted
well:-)

AEG, Bosch, and Miele have a much better
reputation. We have a Miele tower (washer and
condenser tumble drier on the top) which has
been in daily use since 1984) Still going strong!

My ex had nothing but trouble with her Bosch fridge freezer and AEG
washing machine. OTOH, the old Indesit and Electrolux had been utterly
reliable.

Graham

[Patrick Turner]

Iain Churches wrote:

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...

Possibly Hoover had factories in the UK and europe...
where the voltage is nearly the same as ours.


Indeed they did. There was a huge factory on
Western Avenue at Greenford near Acton London W.
I am sure this was not the only one in the UK

Even then, their products were considered as
pretty poor (your machine seems to have lasted
well:-)

Here in Oz in 1978, nearly all my peer group decided the local made
Hoover was a good buy.

It could do a large wash, and was cheaper than most others.

None of the large metalwork items have failed from breakage or corrosion
except the bolt used to hold the wash rotator. OK, I fixed that easy
with a well greased bolt and rubber washer, cost, 1hr and 50c.

But the controller electro mechanical items have failed.

a

AEG, Bosch, and Miele have a much better
reputation. We have a Miele tower (washer and
condenser tumble drier on the top) which has
been in daily use since 1984) Still going strong!

Yes, but those things were very expensive and "hoity toity" laundry ware
in 1978.

Today I phoned several help line numbers given at Hoover's website.
Finally I get to a guy who said there wouldn't be a wiring diagram
available
and that i should ring Electrolux who took over Hoover Aust 20 years
ago.
The girl at Electrolux tells me to ring Hoover, a number with one digit
different from the first time,
and I get the same guy who said I wouldn't be able to get that
schematic.


This is called "getting the run-around"

Then I take a close look at the time unit I did buy from the local
appliance parts dealer
who'd said a week back I wouldn't be able to get a manual or schematic.

Its B&W Timers. I ring the appliance dealer, and the lady there ask him
for the B&W Timer phone
number.
The lady goes away to ask her boss, and comes back after a long wait,
"whadyer want B&W's phone number for?"

"Because I they'd have a schematic for the machine."

Another long wait, and she returns to tell me B&W is their
private contractor and their phone number isn't available.

So with slight cheek of tone in my voice I said I'd find out who B&W are
and talk directly to them about wiring info
and sort out if the timer sold to me is a dud, or fix the machine.

The lady tells me not to be rude.

I said I am not being rude, just factual and practical, and
denying me the phone number of someone who might help me was
restrictive trade practices, and that Australia was a free country.

"What is that you want again?"

"Information of how the timer is connected in the Hoover 800 series
machine.
Its known as the schematic or wiring diagram."

Slight pause,

"I have one in front of me and will have a photo copy waiting for you to
pick up."

I went out to get it, and some very glum faces greeted me.

The guy there gave me the schematic with 4 cards of tradesman I could
phone,
and remarked, "any of these guys can help you."

"But their help is what I am trying to avoid; they all earn lots more
than I do."

And with the schematic, I walked out, and possibly, I might get the
washer going OK again.

If not, i will know exactly why, and proceed to the next step.

But I try to never give anyone the chance to
treat me like a mushroom by feeding me bull**** and keeping me in the
dark.

I've considered making up a batch of heavy duty relays and controlling
them by a
purely electronic timer but that'd take days to R&D, but spare days are
not what I have.

Something for when I retire.

A pedal powered washer is also another fine idea and I'd not need to
ride on the roads so far.

The existing machine could be modified for bicycle chain drive, and the
laundry turned into
a "fitness studio", something all new humble small 55,000 square metre
Oz homes have now
as a standard feature along with a pool room and media room.

I'd have to do my female boarder's washing though....

This leads me to the philisophic question..

If I am prepared to cycle around town for my health 8 hours a week, and
not get paid a cent for it,
then does it matter that i wash someone eles's clothes and do a favour
to another without being paid?

Its an extremely selfish world.

My gain from charity should my better health and a happier lodger.

But to establish the means to the charity, ie, convert the washer to
cycle power is at least several days of R&D and plus parts and labour I
cannot afford.

I'd like to see that lady at the appliance store do a bit of pedal
turning.

She has such a pretty face, but she's at least 125Kgs

Patrick Turner.

[Patrick Turner]

Patrick Turner wrote:

Iain Churches wrote:

And others wrote to compare notes about Hoover 800 series washing
machines.

For the archive, this advice covers top loader
Hoover 820, 830, 835, and 920 as made in Oz from about 1975 onwards.

I got the machine fixed in 30 minutes once I had the schematic as
reluctantly supplied by the
local main Canberra supplier of parts to the appliance fix-it trades.
They sell to the public, so the public should be able to get a copy
of the schematic or risk making a mistake or two like me.

I am always humbled by the **** that happens in this world,
and especially when I have caused some of it to happen,
although unintentionally.

I found that of about 20 wires that plug on the back of the timer
control unit
There were 4 that were misplaced, and its a wonder the machine worked at
all.
I thought only one wire was wrong.
So during the 4 previous occasions when I replaced the controller wire
by wire without a schematic
I probably got a wire or two wrong, and finally one came off a lug and
the machine stopped last week.

Checking with the schematic is very easy since the wiring harness has
all dual colour striped wire,
and all you have to do is check the wire colour against the pin out
number printed on the controller.

Anyone could do it with a minimum of skill, but the lug connections tend
to get
loose as grippers loose tension, so squeeze a bit with long nose pliers
while they are off the lugs,
then clip them back on tight, and they'll maybe OK for the next 30 years
of washing.

Of course Hoover would have saved lots of bothers if they'd had
all the wires brought to the controller in ONE plug with many
connections,
or maybe TWO plugs, then there'd be no way wires could be misplaced,
but they must have thought it too expensive to produce multipin plugs
and a controller with convenient pin out positions which would all work
and be safe with
240V mains and considerable currents.



And BTW, for umbilical cables between PSUs and amplifiers,
I tried to find multi wired cable which allowed opposite phases of
240Vrms applied to each
adjacent pair of wires at up to 4 amps.
Another local electrical supplier found a source for such cable,
but he couldn't find a cheap simple 12 to 18 plug and chassis socket.
So I will stick to tube type octal plugs and sockets.
Multi pin plugs used for car trailers are OK except that it does not
look
OK for highish DC or AC voltages in tube amps.
7 pin is the highest number I saw.

In my 845 amps I have 13 connections, so 16 pins of 2 x octal plugs will
do,
and I will leave a pin each side of the +750V unconnected.

Patrick Turner.






"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...

Possibly Hoover had factories in the UK and europe...
where the voltage is nearly the same as ours.


Indeed they did. There was a huge factory on
Western Avenue at Greenford near Acton London W.
I am sure this was not the only one in the UK

Even then, their products were considered as
pretty poor (your machine seems to have lasted
well:-)

Here in Oz in 1978, nearly all my peer group decided the local made
Hoover was a good buy.

It could do a large wash, and was cheaper than most others.

None of the large metalwork items have failed from breakage or corrosion
except the bolt used to hold the wash rotator. OK, I fixed that easy
with a well greased bolt and rubber washer, cost, 1hr and 50c.

But the controller electro mechanical items have failed.

a

AEG, Bosch, and Miele have a much better
reputation. We have a Miele tower (washer and
condenser tumble drier on the top) which has
been in daily use since 1984) Still going strong!

Yes, but those things were very expensive and "hoity toity" laundry ware
in 1978.

Today I phoned several help line numbers given at Hoover's website.
Finally I get to a guy who said there wouldn't be a wiring diagram
available
and that i should ring Electrolux who took over Hoover Aust 20 years
ago.
The girl at Electrolux tells me to ring Hoover, a number with one digit
different from the first time,
and I get the same guy who said I wouldn't be able to get that
schematic.

This is called "getting the run-around"

Then I take a close look at the time unit I did buy from the local
appliance parts dealer
who'd said a week back I wouldn't be able to get a manual or schematic.

Its B&W Timers. I ring the appliance dealer, and the lady there ask him
for the B&W Timer phone
number.
The lady goes away to ask her boss, and comes back after a long wait,
"whadyer want B&W's phone number for?"

"Because I they'd have a schematic for the machine."

Another long wait, and she returns to tell me B&W is their
private contractor and their phone number isn't available.

So with slight cheek of tone in my voice I said I'd find out who B&W are
and talk directly to them about wiring info
and sort out if the timer sold to me is a dud, or fix the machine.

The lady tells me not to be rude.

I said I am not being rude, just factual and practical, and
denying me the phone number of someone who might help me was
restrictive trade practices, and that Australia was a free country.

"What is that you want again?"

"Information of how the timer is connected in the Hoover 800 series
machine.
Its known as the schematic or wiring diagram."

Slight pause,

"I have one in front of me and will have a photo copy waiting for you to
pick up."

I went out to get it, and some very glum faces greeted me.

The guy there gave me the schematic with 4 cards of tradesman I could
phone,
and remarked, "any of these guys can help you."

"But their help is what I am trying to avoid; they all earn lots more
than I do."

And with the schematic, I walked out, and possibly, I might get the
washer going OK again.

If not, i will know exactly why, and proceed to the next step.

But I try to never give anyone the chance to
treat me like a mushroom by feeding me bull**** and keeping me in the
dark.

I've considered making up a batch of heavy duty relays and controlling
them by a
purely electronic timer but that'd take days to R&D, but spare days are
not what I have.

Something for when I retire.

A pedal powered washer is also another fine idea and I'd not need to
ride on the roads so far.

The existing machine could be modified for bicycle chain drive, and the
laundry turned into
a "fitness studio", something all new humble small 55,000 square metre
Oz homes have now
as a standard feature along with a pool room and media room.

I'd have to do my female boarder's washing though....

This leads me to the philisophic question..

If I am prepared to cycle around town for my health 8 hours a week, and
not get paid a cent for it,
then does it matter that i wash someone eles's clothes and do a favour
to another without being paid?

Its an extremely selfish world.

My gain from charity should my better health and a happier lodger.

But to establish the means to the charity, ie, convert the washer to
cycle power is at least several days of R&D and plus parts and labour I
cannot afford.

I'd like to see that lady at the appliance store do a bit of pedal
turning.

She has such a pretty face, but she's at least 125Kgs

Patrick Turner.

[Ian Iveson]

Patrick said:

Searches didn't yield much,
and trying to work out the schematic of the
timer control with 60 position switch and the control unit
with 20 wire connections, one or two of which may be
incorrect
is not easy.

Its a tough old machine, but the ****in Hoover timer
control module
has failed 4 times since 1978, but all else seems to test
OK.

How could the connections become incorrect?

Ian

[Patrick Turner]

Ian Iveson wrote:

Patrick said:

Searches didn't yield much,
and trying to work out the schematic of the
timer control with 60 position switch and the control unit
with 20 wire connections, one or two of which may be
incorrect
is not easy.

Its a tough old machine, but the ****in Hoover timer
control module
has failed 4 times since 1978, but all else seems to test
OK.

How could the connections become incorrect?

If you'd read all the posts I made about the old machine,
you'd have seen how I admitted that after replacing faulty
timers without a schematic, I managed to get several wires to wrong
connections.
This was very very easy to do, because the wires all have individual
crimped slide on connections, not a multiposition plug.
So you pull one lug off an old terminal, and move it to the same
position lug on the new timer box.
So a single mistake may not be noticed.
And the same mistake can be repeated, and another created on the next
timer replacement.

The schematic for the machine should have been supplied with the
machine,
or supplied by the parts supplier with the suply of a new timer.
None of these wrong connections made unknowingly over the last 10 years
seemed to have affected
the main heavy duty cycle I normally used.

Anyway, one connection came right off a lug last week, giving
the same symptoms of a failing timer, ie, the machine would fill, and
pump out,
but not wash or spin.
I replaced the timer, and the same symptoms occurred, leading me to
think
that maybe the original timer was OK,
maybe the replacement is a dud,
maybe the motor or some other part
such as the motor micro switches had become faulty; ie, open circuit
somewhere.
And maybe I had the wrong lugs pressed onto the wrong terminals.

There is a thermal cut out to protect against excessive mains current so
its impossible to burn
out the motor.

This kept tripping. I tried several terminals for the wire that had
sprung off the
unknown terminal and no good results.

So maybe I needed a schematic, because working out what wire was
supposed to go to what terminal
without knowing schematic of the complex sequenced internal and
concealed timer switching,
working out what was switched to what and when would have taken me ages.

The spare parts shop reluctantly gave me a copy of the
schematic and in 30 minutes I had all the wires properly connected and
it actually
now washes better on the less used 'delicate' non standard cycle.

It is probable that the timer I have replaced is quite OK,
and it worries me not that i now have a spare for use when the present
replacement fails perhaps in 4 to 6 years time.
Then there may be no further support for timer repairs and the machine
then becomes redundant.
But I think I hove a spare, and maybe I won't need to dispatch the
machine to re-cyclers until I am 72,
at about the time when I myself may expire, and need recycling by
conversion into
gasses uppa chimney, and a bowl of ashes for fertilizer, ie, if the
Greenhouse Police
still permit cremations. No doubt there will soon be a HUGE carbon tax
imposed upon
the living for a cremation, or claimable by a government out of a
deceased estate.

People will begin secretly burrying their grandparents and parents in
graves in the back yard late at night or underneath the loungeroom to
avoid the taxes.

Much of what goes on amoung those living above their dead relatives will
cause a noise
similar to a spinning washing machine, no doubt about that!

It cost $8,000 to dispose of my sister's remains after she died of
cancer.

I reckon it was an outrageous waste of money, but then she spent
$10,000 on her marriage, and it lasted only 3 years.

If a bus runs over me while I'm out cycling,
I hope they have a nice big fire hose to wash my reamins down a drain
somewhere.
Outa sight and outa mind, and the pong lasts no longer than
the pongs when large kangaroos get mangled and left to rot by the
roadside.

During my 107km ride today, I cycled past one 4km stretch of road where
20 piles of bone lay at the road edge.

There is a real argy bargy going on amoung roo lovers and roo cullers,
as to whether they should cull the excessive population of roos.

But while they dither and ague, and carryon politically posturing,
roos are dying in agony and ruining motor cars at alarming rates.

I'd force all the roo lovers to ride the roads where I see the carnage.

They'd want the fences all raised from 1M high to 2M, to stop the roos
jumping over them.
Pollies and farmers would object because its all too expensive.

But roos are clever, they find a way onto road spaces, and once there
they are the dumbest
or poor brutes, and have no sense of road dangers, and will jump right
in front
or vehicles travelling at 100kph.

The wombats, wild foxes, rabbits and many bird species also litter
Australian roadsides. The repairs keep an army of panel beaters well
healed.
What you see that's dead is the tip of the iceberg because wounded
critters
try to get away but die from wounds and shock just out of sight,
judging by the pongs and absense of obvious corpse.

The worst thing is when a large roo comes into the cab through the
windshield,
and while still alive it kicks around violently and the results to
occupants
and accident outcome is appalling.
The bloodstains are difficult to remove.

Patrick Turner.

[Ian Iveson]

Patrick Turner wrote

How could the connections become incorrect?

If you'd read all the posts I made about the old machine,
you'd have seen how I admitted that after replacing faulty
timers without a schematic, I managed to get several wires
to wrong
connections.
This was very very easy to do, because the wires all have
individual
crimped slide on connections, not a multiposition plug.
So you pull one lug off an old terminal, and move it to
the same
position lug on the new timer box.
So a single mistake may not be noticed.
And the same mistake can be repeated, and another created
on the next
timer replacement.

The schematic for the machine should have been supplied
with the
machine,
or supplied by the parts supplier with the suply of a new
timer.
None of these wrong connections made unknowingly over the
last 10 years
seemed to have affected
the main heavy duty cycle I normally used.

Anyway, one connection came right off a lug last week,
giving
the same symptoms of a failing timer, ie, the machine
would fill, and
pump out,
but not wash or spin.
I replaced the timer, and the same symptoms occurred,
leading me to
think
that maybe the original timer was OK,
maybe the replacement is a dud,
maybe the motor or some other part
such as the motor micro switches had become faulty; ie,
open circuit
somewhere.
And maybe I had the wrong lugs pressed onto the wrong
terminals.

There is a thermal cut out to protect against excessive
mains current so
its impossible to burn
out the motor.

This kept tripping. I tried several terminals for the wire
that had
sprung off the
unknown terminal and no good results.

So maybe I needed a schematic, because working out what
wire was
supposed to go to what terminal
without knowing schematic of the complex sequenced
internal and
concealed timer switching,
working out what was switched to what and when would have
taken me ages.

The spare parts shop reluctantly gave me a copy of the
schematic and in 30 minutes I had all the wires properly
connected and
it actually
now washes better on the less used 'delicate' non standard
cycle.

It is probable that the timer I have replaced is quite OK,
and it worries me not that i now have a spare for use when
the present
replacement fails perhaps in 4 to 6 years time.
Then there may be no further support for timer repairs and
the machine
then becomes redundant.
But I think I hove a spare, and maybe I won't need to
dispatch the
machine to re-cyclers until I am 72,
at about the time when I myself may expire, and need
recycling by
conversion into
gasses uppa chimney, and a bowl of ashes for fertilizer,
ie, if the
Greenhouse Police
still permit cremations. No doubt there will soon be a
HUGE carbon tax
imposed upon
the living for a cremation, or claimable by a government
out of a
deceased estate.

People will begin secretly burrying their grandparents and
parents in
graves in the back yard late at night or underneath the
loungeroom to
avoid the taxes.

Much of what goes on amoung those living above their dead
relatives will
cause a noise
similar to a spinning washing machine, no doubt about
that!

It cost $8,000 to dispose of my sister's remains after she
died of
cancer.

I reckon it was an outrageous waste of money, but then she
spent
$10,000 on her marriage, and it lasted only 3 years.

If a bus runs over me while I'm out cycling,
I hope they have a nice big fire hose to wash my reamins
down a drain
somewhere.
Outa sight and outa mind, and the pong lasts no longer
than
the pongs when large kangaroos get mangled and left to rot
by the
roadside.

During my 107km ride today, I cycled past one 4km stretch
of road where
20 piles of bone lay at the road edge.

There is a real argy bargy going on amoung roo lovers and
roo cullers,
as to whether they should cull the excessive population of
roos.

But while they dither and ague, and carryon politically
posturing,
roos are dying in agony and ruining motor cars at alarming
rates.

I'd force all the roo lovers to ride the roads where I see
the carnage.

They'd want the fences all raised from 1M high to 2M, to
stop the roos
jumping over them.
Pollies and farmers would object because its all too
expensive.

But roos are clever, they find a way onto road spaces, and
once there
they are the dumbest
or poor brutes, and have no sense of road dangers, and
will jump right
in front
or vehicles travelling at 100kph.

The wombats, wild foxes, rabbits and many bird species
also litter
Australian roadsides. The repairs keep an army of panel
beaters well
healed.
What you see that's dead is the tip of the iceberg because
wounded
critters
try to get away but die from wounds and shock just out of
sight,
judging by the pongs and absense of obvious corpse.

The worst thing is when a large roo comes into the cab
through the
windshield,
and while still alive it kicks around violently and the
results to
occupants
and accident outcome is appalling.
The bloodstains are difficult to remove.

There is a fashion for eating roadkill here.

My colour vision is poor enough for me to have never
developed much of a memory for colour. Even if I can see the
different colours of wires, I know I won't be able to
remember where they were. So I got into the habit of
labelling connections with numbers before disconnecting
anything.

Nevertheless, I suffer occasional bouts of denial. At the
time of disassembly, it always feels to me like I will
remember where everything goes, and so I'm tempted to forego
the tedium of labelling. It's a matter of discipline, and
that's something about which we both feel ambivalent.

My previous Hoover front loader, possibly the first they
made, donated with blown motor cap by the mean parents of
some Scottish wife, ran for ten years with its controller
bound with string because its insides fell out after its
rivets rotted. They are remarkably reliable, considering
their complexity. Eventually the chassis rotted at a crucial
mounting point, and welding is something I've never got
into.

Its replacement went totally haywire after eight weeks. It
was a fright to see quite how badly a washing machine can
misbehave with a malfunctioning controller. Replaced under
guarantee, it ran for fifteen years without incident until a
couple of weeks ago. I've just replaced a slipping drive
belt. I guess one difference between an expensive machine
and a cheap one is a proper belt tensioner, and a wiring
loom that doesn't pass through the loop, so I had to label
dozens of wires and their inaccessible locations. Took half
a day at least.

Frank Zappa's "Flakes" in which a parody of Dylan whinges
that "they said it would be ready by Friday, but they took
all weekend, didn't do nothing, AND CHARGED ME DOUBLE FOR
SUNDAY", made me laugh.

Ian