Once upon a midnight clear....

On Dec 24 2009, 5:35*pm, MiNe 109 >
wrote:
> In article
> >,
> *John Atkinson > wrote:
>
> > On Dec 24, 1:28*pm, George M. Middius >
> > wrote:
> > > 'Twas the night before Kroodown, and all 'round Goose Puke...
>
> > An oldie but goldie, George. But the foe seems long gone,
> > if not into that dark night, at least somewhere else.
>
> > But Harold Ferstler has reemerged, writing equipment
> > reports for AudioXpress under the title "Reliable Reviews."
>
> He's beating the same old drum, with ossified thoughts about level
> matching, pink noise and even that Villchur live-vs-recorded string
> quartet demo.
>
> "Reliable." Gotta give him that!
>
> Stephen

Yo, Stephen. Interesting to see that after me being away for months
and months you still have not found anything better to do with your
life than make smart-assed remarks about me on RAO. Yeah, I am
reliable, and I am also correct.

It is interesting that you found a relatively straightforward article
on setting up speaker levels for intelligent comparison work so "old
drum" in concept. How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
conclusions?

As for the Villchur demos, well, you have not a clue what you are
talking about.

Howard Ferstler

In article
>,
Ferstler > wrote:

> On Dec 24 2009, 5:35*pm, MiNe 109 >
> wrote:
> > In article
> > >,
> > *John Atkinson > wrote:
> >
> > > On Dec 24, 1:28*pm, George M. Middius >
> > > wrote:
> > > > 'Twas the night before Kroodown, and all 'round Goose Puke...
> >
> > > An oldie but goldie, George. But the foe seems long gone,
> > > if not into that dark night, at least somewhere else.
> >
> > > But Harold Ferstler has reemerged, writing equipment
> > > reports for AudioXpress under the title "Reliable Reviews."
> >
> > He's beating the same old drum, with ossified thoughts about level
> > matching, pink noise and even that Villchur live-vs-recorded string
> > quartet demo.
> >
> > "Reliable." Gotta give him that!
> >
> > Stephen
>
> Yo, Stephen. Interesting to see that after me being away for months
> and months you still have not found anything better to do with your
> life than make smart-assed remarks about me on RAO. Yeah, I am
> reliable, and I am also correct.

I made a bunch of other comments that hardly mentioned you at all.

> It is interesting that you found a relatively straightforward article
> on setting up speaker levels for intelligent comparison work so "old
> drum" in concept. How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> conclusions?
>
> As for the Villchur demos, well, you have not a clue what you are
> talking about.

That would be a failure of your powers of description if you really
think so.

Stephen

In article
>,
Ferstler > wrote:

> How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> conclusions?

I don't churn my equipment. In my main system I'm happy with my Quads.
In the tv systems the differences are large enough that level-matching,
etc is too much trouble.

Stephen

On Jan 7, 4:11*pm, MiNe 109 > wrote:
> In article
> >,
>
>
>
>
>
> *Ferstler > wrote:
> > On Dec 24 2009, 5:35*pm, MiNe 109 * >
> > wrote:
> > > In article
> > > >,
> > > *John Atkinson > wrote:
>
> > > > On Dec 24, 1:28*pm, George M. Middius >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > 'Twas the night before Kroodown, and all 'round Goose Puke...
>
> > > > An oldie but goldie, George. But the foe seems long gone,
> > > > if not into that dark night, at least somewhere else.
>
> > > > But Harold Ferstler has reemerged, writing equipment
> > > > reports for AudioXpress under the title "Reliable Reviews."
>
> > > He's beating the same old drum, with ossified thoughts about level
> > > matching, pink noise and even that Villchur live-vs-recorded string
> > > quartet demo.
>
> > > "Reliable." Gotta give him that!
>
> > > Stephen
>
> > Yo, Stephen. Interesting to see that after me being away for months
> > and months you still have not found anything better to do with your
> > life than make smart-assed remarks about me on RAO. Yeah, I am
> > reliable, and I am also correct.
>
> I made a bunch of other comments that hardly mentioned you at all.
>
> > It is interesting that you found a relatively straightforward article
> > on setting up speaker levels for intelligent comparison work so "old
> > drum" in concept. How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> > level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> > conclusions?
>
> > As for the Villchur demos, well, you have not a clue what you are
> > talking about.
>
> That would be a failure of your powers of description if you really
> think so.
>
> Stephen- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

You are a paradigm of the modern audio expert and enthusiast. I'll bet
you have never done a refined comparison between speakers or between
amps in your life.

Howard Ferstler

On Jan 7, 4:13*pm, MiNe 109 > wrote:
> In article
> >,
>
> *Ferstler > wrote:
> > How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> > level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> > conclusions?
>
> I don't churn my equipment. In my main system I'm happy with my Quads.
> In the tv systems the differences are large enough that level-matching,
> etc is too much trouble.
>
> Stephen

Too much trouble?. Yep, you are a paradigm of the ignorance is bliss
audio buff.

Howard Ferstler

In article
>,
Ferstler > wrote:

> On Jan 7, 4:11*pm, MiNe 109 > wrote:
> > In article
> > >,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *Ferstler > wrote:
> > > On Dec 24 2009, 5:35*pm, MiNe 109 * >
> > > wrote:
> > > > In article
> > > > >,
> > > > *John Atkinson > wrote:
> >
> > > > > On Dec 24, 1:28*pm, George M. Middius >
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > 'Twas the night before Kroodown, and all 'round Goose Puke...
> >
> > > > > An oldie but goldie, George. But the foe seems long gone,
> > > > > if not into that dark night, at least somewhere else.
> >
> > > > > But Harold Ferstler has reemerged, writing equipment
> > > > > reports for AudioXpress under the title "Reliable Reviews."
> >
> > > > He's beating the same old drum, with ossified thoughts about level
> > > > matching, pink noise and even that Villchur live-vs-recorded string
> > > > quartet demo.
> >
> > > > "Reliable." Gotta give him that!
> >
> > > > Stephen
> >
> > > Yo, Stephen. Interesting to see that after me being away for months
> > > and months you still have not found anything better to do with your
> > > life than make smart-assed remarks about me on RAO. Yeah, I am
> > > reliable, and I am also correct.
> >
> > I made a bunch of other comments that hardly mentioned you at all.
> >
> > > It is interesting that you found a relatively straightforward article
> > > on setting up speaker levels for intelligent comparison work so "old
> > > drum" in concept. How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> > > level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> > > conclusions?
> >
> > > As for the Villchur demos, well, you have not a clue what you are
> > > talking about.
> >
> > That would be a failure of your powers of description if you really
> > think so.
> >
> > Stephen- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> You are a paradigm of the modern audio expert and enthusiast. I'll bet
> you have never done a refined comparison between speakers or between
> amps in your life.

Here's a clue, Howard: Most people who like listening to their audio
systems and to music haven't, never will, and don't care to.

On Jan 7, 3:55*pm, Jenn > wrote:
> In article
> >,
>
>
>
>
>
> *Ferstler > wrote:
> > On Jan 7, 4:11 pm, MiNe 109 * > wrote:
> > > In article
> > > >,
>
> > > Ferstler > wrote:
> > > > On Dec 24 2009, 5:35 pm, MiNe 109 >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > In article
> > > > > >,
> > > > > John Atkinson > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Dec 24, 1:28 pm, George M. Middius >
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > 'Twas the night before Kroodown, and all 'round Goose Puke...
>
> > > > > > An oldie but goldie, George. But the foe seems long gone,
> > > > > > if not into that dark night, at least somewhere else.
>
> > > > > > But Harold Ferstler has reemerged, writing equipment
> > > > > > reports for AudioXpress under the title "Reliable Reviews."
>
> > > > > He's beating the same old drum, with ossified thoughts about level
> > > > > matching, pink noise and even that Villchur live-vs-recorded string
> > > > > quartet demo.
>
> > > > > "Reliable." Gotta give him that!
>
> > > > > Stephen
>
> > > > Yo, Stephen. Interesting to see that after me being away for months
> > > > and months you still have not found anything better to do with your
> > > > life than make smart-assed remarks about me on RAO. Yeah, I am
> > > > reliable, and I am also correct.
>
> > > I made a bunch of other comments that hardly mentioned you at all.
>
> > > > It is interesting that you found a relatively straightforward article
> > > > on setting up speaker levels for intelligent comparison work so "old
> > > > drum" in concept. How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> > > > level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> > > > conclusions?
>
> > > > As for the Villchur demos, well, you have not a clue what you are
> > > > talking about.
>
> > > That would be a failure of your powers of description if you really
> > > think so.
>
> > > Stephen- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > You are a paradigm of the modern audio expert and enthusiast. I'll bet
> > you have never done a refined comparison between speakers or between
> > amps in your life.
>
> Here's a clue, Howard: *Most people who like listening to their audio
> systems and to music haven't, never will, and don't care to.

Amen.

In article
>,
Ferstler > wrote:

> On Jan 7, 4:11*pm, MiNe 109 > wrote:
> > In article
> > >,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *Ferstler > wrote:
> > > On Dec 24 2009, 5:35*pm, MiNe 109 * >
> > > wrote:
> > > > In article
> > > > >,
> > > > *John Atkinson > wrote:
> >
> > > > > On Dec 24, 1:28*pm, George M. Middius >
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > 'Twas the night before Kroodown, and all 'round Goose Puke...
> >
> > > > > An oldie but goldie, George. But the foe seems long gone,
> > > > > if not into that dark night, at least somewhere else.
> >
> > > > > But Harold Ferstler has reemerged, writing equipment
> > > > > reports for AudioXpress under the title "Reliable Reviews."
> >
> > > > He's beating the same old drum, with ossified thoughts about level
> > > > matching, pink noise and even that Villchur live-vs-recorded string
> > > > quartet demo.
> >
> > > > "Reliable." Gotta give him that!
> >
> > > > Stephen
> >
> > > Yo, Stephen. Interesting to see that after me being away for months
> > > and months you still have not found anything better to do with your
> > > life than make smart-assed remarks about me on RAO. Yeah, I am
> > > reliable, and I am also correct.
> >
> > I made a bunch of other comments that hardly mentioned you at all.
> >
> > > It is interesting that you found a relatively straightforward article
> > > on setting up speaker levels for intelligent comparison work so "old
> > > drum" in concept. How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> > > level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> > > conclusions?
> >
> > > As for the Villchur demos, well, you have not a clue what you are
> > > talking about.
> >
> > That would be a failure of your powers of description if you really
> > think so.
> >
> > Stephen- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> You are a paradigm of the modern audio expert and enthusiast. I'll bet
> you have never done a refined comparison between speakers or between
> amps in your life.

If by that you mean I've never tried to guess if a string quartet in a
train station is miming or not, you're right.

Stephen

In article
>,
Ferstler > wrote:

> On Jan 7, 4:13*pm, MiNe 109 > wrote:
> > In article
> > >,
> >
> > *Ferstler > wrote:
> > > How do you compare speakers, bucko? Do you bother to
> > > level match at all, or do you just guesstimate and then revel in your
> > > conclusions?
> >
> > I don't churn my equipment. In my main system I'm happy with my Quads.
> > In the tv systems the differences are large enough that level-matching,
> > etc is too much trouble.
> >
> > Stephen
>
> Too much trouble?. Yep, you are a paradigm of the ignorance is bliss
> audio buff.

It's like Scottie with a new word.

Stephen

On Jan 7, 4:55*pm, Jenn > wrote:
> In article
>
> Here's a clue, Howard: *Most people who like listening to their audio
> systems and to music haven't, never will, and don't care to.

Good point, at least as it relates to people like you. This is one
reason (not the only one, but at least one of the reasons) the hobby
has declined into the muddle it is today. There are two kinds of
primary embracers of the hobby as it now exists.

(1) The kind who go to Best Buy with a small budget, buy some packaged
gear, take it home and enjoy it in blissful ignorance. I actually
admire people like that.

(2) The kind who go to an audio salon with big bucks in hand and
purchase items that look good, sound maybe decent, and which were
possibly praised in some lunatic-fringe magazine report. For people
like this, audio is almost a religious experience that demands as
little rational behavior as possible.

Neither (1) nor (2) has any interest in understanding just why the
gear they have is good (or possibly not so good), with the underlying
motivation based upon blissful ignorance.The first group has many
other things on their minds than audio, and their lack of interest in
the details is actually quite normal. Sometimes blissful ignorance is
a good thing.

On the other hand, the second group continues to baffle me, because so
many of them spend large percentages of their respective net worths on
audio gear, and yet do not take the time to analyze whether or not
their cash outlays (or credit charges) are paying off in absolute
terms. No doubt, they are paying off in terms related to wishful
thinking and speculation, of course, but is that something that is
healthy for anyone? Is it normal for a person who is seriously
interested in a hobby to willfully be ignorant of some of the more
basic concepts around that hobby, or be lacking in any kind of
interest that involves knowing instead of believing? Audio is the only
hobby I know of where many of those supposedly interested in it are
not interested in digging any deeper into the details than what
speculation offers. If that is not the very definition of religion, I
do not know what else is. It is the only hobby I know of where so many
enthusiasts are utterly uninterested in basic epistemology.

Today, most so-called audio enthusiasts are paradigm know-nothings.
Perhaps 20 percent of them are on the ball and aware of the issues and
how to resolve them. The remaining 80 percent are jerks.

And for now I leave you jerks to your various tempests in teapots. I
may drop back in one of these days to again marvel that the same
people continue to rant, rave, and carp by banging on their keyboards.

Howard Ferstler