And now I must away to my information trails and TV, to see
if Lance can ride up hills and win his sixth Tour.

Patrick Turner.

Patrick Turner wrote:
And now I must away to my information trails and TV, to see
if Lance can ride up hills and win his sixth Tour.

Patrick Turner.

Great guy, I had same cancer as him, with seconds lungs and lymphs

Wish treatment had made me as fast as him on a bike


Dave

"Fran=E7ois Yves Le Gal" wrote:

On Wed, 14 Jul 2004 14:19:59 GMT, "Dave xxxx" wrot=
e:

Wish treatment had made me as fast as him on a bike

You haven't taken enough corticoids, EPO and HGH, then.

Just saw the end of today's stage, with Richard Virenque - a convicted =
EPO
junkie - riding alone for 200 km or so and taking a five minute lead on=
the
other riders. He was fresher after this stage than anyone is after clim=
bing
a couple of stairs...

Isn't today's pharmaceutical research wonderful?

I did 160 km last weekend (on a bicycle). But there is nothing on me
that 40 years wouldn't fix. If I live I will be 72 in September. Never
be a Lance Armstrong now, even with steroids.

Cheers, John Stewart

Dave xxxx wrote:

Patrick Turner wrote:
And now I must away to my information trails and TV, to see
if Lance can ride up hills and win his sixth Tour.

Patrick Turner.

Great guy, I had same cancer as him, with seconds lungs and lymphs

Wish treatment had made me as fast as him on a bike

Dave

Compared to most othe the other wanna be's, he radiates genuine calm and
statesmanship
about his achievements on a bike.
I get embarrassed sometimes when I here the drivel from the Oz sprinters

right after the wins they are getting after the races along the flat
country.

A sore loser isn't as bad as an arrogant winner.

Virenque did OK today when the real race started, because it had some
hills,
and where drafting behind the others in the peleton does not help.
I think Lance will make a big effort soon, to place his stamp on the
race, but today wasn't the day,
and nobody has threatened him yet.....

I used to race here in the ACT veterans cycling every saturday, and the
competition was quite
fierce on the road, but I liked the challenge. I didn't win much,
because being there
is more important than winning, and I was never a natural elete athlete
like Lance and the others,
who have natural attributes, like a low fat% in their weight of less
than 8%.
I was once measured at about 18% when I was in top form, so I
was like Lance but with three house bricks in the saddle bag.
And I could never keep my heart rate at 180 bpm for time trials, 140 was
max,
even at age 40, and I never had the lung and muscle capacity.
There were ex-professionals and ex Oz cycling champions in my club,
and they were unbeatable when they aged, against anyone else of the same
age.
A couple of blokes over 50 managed 40k in under the hour, one used to do

8 k in 11 minutes like most of the younger set.
I could never get under 1:06, and I was 41.

But Stephen Hodge, who rode in the Tour De France a few times managed
9.5 minutes for the
8 k time trial, when he was over here on holidays away from Europe and
out of season.

I must have ridden 100,000 miles in the 6 years I spent cycling as a
veteran,
but at the end of it I felt very satisfied, but also like a mule that
needed a rest...
There were more interesting things to do than peddling around and
around, and around....


Patrick Turner.

"François Yves Le Gal" wrote:

On Wed, 14 Jul 2004 14:19:59 GMT, "Dave xxxx" wrote:

Wish treatment had made me as fast as him on a bike

You haven't taken enough corticoids, EPO and HGH, then.

Just saw the end of today's stage, with Richard Virenque - a convicted EPO
junkie - riding alone for 200 km or so and taking a five minute lead on the
other riders. He was fresher after this stage than anyone is after climbing
a couple of stairs...

Isn't today's pharmaceutical research wonderful?

I dunno whether he is taking anything now, but then who isn't?

Several of our stars destined for the Athens games have been dropped
because they were shooting up horse growth hormones....

Drugs in sport are here to stay, but one has to realize that some athletes are
just never going to ever beat a born natural, even if they were full of all the
banned
and detectable drugs.

I'd be very surprised if Virenque gets to Paris in less time than Lance.
If any of the others who Lance fears may be a threat had also rushed off the
front of the bunch,
Lance would have reacted.
Breakaways are only chased down by the Peloton for a reason.
Le Tour is a game of tactics, and with lots of calculated moves and strategies,
and keeping one's reserve
for the right time to spring when everyone else is weak, and leaving oneself in
good enough shape
for the day after.
And its team work.

But this is Lance's unique chance to win 6 in a row, which hasn't been done
before,
and the mountain stages ahead will soon see if he can achieve it, and as they
say,
it ain't over until the fat lady sings.

There would be those who fancy beating him this time, but I am not sure who
they might be.

Patrick Turner.

"François Yves Le Gal" wrote:

On Thu, 15 Jul 2004 20:23:00 +1000, Patrick Turner
wrote:

I dunno whether he is taking anything now, but then who isn't?

According to a former pro, more than 90% of the riders regularly take drugs.

Several of our stars destined for the Athens games have been dropped
because they were shooting up horse growth hormones....

Ditto everywhere, or so it seems.

Drugs in sport are here to stay, but one has to realize that some athletes are
just never going to ever beat a born natural, even if they were full of all the
banned and detectable drugs.

Agreed. But nobody can do what today's riders do during the Tour or similar
"events".

Nobody except the riders who do it that is.
And the history of Le Tour goes back a long way, and before drugs,
the roads were terrible, stages often went for longer, and the riders
had little support, ie, no masseurs and sports psychologists,
and precious few support cars with bikes, food, etc.
The 200 riders in Le Tour represent a tiny number of the riders who regularly
compete
professionally in Europe.
They could have 20 teams of 200 each if they wanted to.
I have ridden 300 Kms in a single ride between 1 am and 4 pm with 15 minutes for a
stop,
and although I was slow, and did 1/2 the distance alone, and into a headwind which
slowed me to a crawl,
I didn't die. Blokes 1/2 the age I was then and at the top of their naturally gifted
prowess
can easily manage what they achieve; it looks difficult, but it really isn't,
if you have good luck.

Its just that accumulating even 8 seconds less on the road than all the other riders

in a 3,000 Km race takes rather good ability, and good luck.
Greg Lemond won 3 tours, and in one he won by that small a margin.
Indurain was a big man, but he made it look easy.
What of Stephen Roche, we won the Tour of Italy, Spain and France,
all in the one year.
He was just real little guy.
Nearly all the greats were real good at individual time trials where you race
against the clock,
with no peleton to suck you along when you are not at the front.
And they are good climbers, mountains bother them less than they bother everyone
else.

Of course of the 200 who start, a lot come to grief at some point.
I recall one rider who was forced to quit because he found had a large tapeworm in
his gut.

Sport has become a big entertainment business, and all of the
rules of sportsmanship have conveniently been forgotten: riders take
whatever they can - or can't - in order to reach the op and stay there.

Well, of those who take something, they try to take what isn't illegal, or for what
there is no detection test.
Once they find a test, it becomes illegal, and they swing to something else.
But I have seen the footage of many tours, and I have raced in so many races that
I know what goes on regarding sportsmanship. Once, in a bunch sprint for the line
in the last 100 metres of a race I was elbowed and pushed right off the road
and forced to crash arse over head by younger blokes only wanting to win, even if it
meant
actions tantamount to attempted manslaughter, and the officials did not take the
slightest action.
And the visions of glory and winning in a bunch sprint make grown lads do all sorts
of regrettable things
in their blind charge for the line. Soldiers are also dangerous when they get into a
charge.
The human becomes a maddened blind bull.
But not too often in Le Tour. They largely abide by the rules, and they race like
gentlemen
compared to the amateur ruffians I had to cope with in a local suburban cycling
club.
The jokeying for positions in the massed sprint for the line at the end of stages
is a precarious time, and its a wonder more don't get killed; there have been some
quite spectacular crashes in the Tour's history.
Some men live for such wild and dangerous moments, such is the raising of their
reflexes and awareness, with complete abandonment of any othewise mundane concerns.


There would be those who fancy beating him this time, but I am not sure who
they might be.

Dunno, and don't really ca my point was about the widespread of drugs in
pro cycling.

Drugs permeate sport at all levels. Its so easy to be tempted, especially if you
have enough natural
talent to become an elite sportsman, and end up with a life at a national or state
sports institute.

So few just do it because they just want the money.
These competitive ppl love the glory of winning, and seeing others crumble,
and the enjoying the world touring, being important, and making social connections
for their future when they are too old at 35 for the field, track, road, or pool,
but with 50 years of life to lead.
They get a chance to be a hero, and it all intoxicates them.
It makes a whole nation proud of its nationhood
They are drunk with their own power, drugged by their own successes.
Its silly, of course, such rampant nationalism, when you realize that
elite sport is extremely selfish.
But ever since the original Olympics in Greece, there have been
guys, and a few gals, who liked to perform in front of crowds
because it made for a good day out for everybody.

But most of us slug away with our dreary work, unable to escape the grind,
and we are lucky if we enjoy it. No medals, podium champagne, or national anthem
when we complete a good job.

I also play chess, and over the years I have seen all sorts across the table,
and one dude used to lose a bit to me, which didn't please him at all because
I am a very average player, and then he'd go off to the loo for 5 minutes, and when
he got back
his eyes were like saucers and he'd start winning, then he'd "dance on my corpse" as
it were.
I never knew what he took, probably cocaine or amphetamines.
"Oh Patrick" he said once, " If you could only see what I can see on the board
now.."
Maybe not just the position of peices....
But sometimes he'd go take "his medicine" and return to the table and continue
losing!
It didn't always work out, and I'd have the private laugh.
And I think the same about some of these endurance sportsman.
Sometimes they are taking all this junk, and sure its "bad" and "illegal",
but they might actually perform worse.
What of vitamins and "energy suplements" that don't naturally occur in mountainous
platefuls
of pasta?
Do we outlaw all that too?

Have you ever seen a winner of Le Tour who has been caught taking
bottle fuls of drugs?
Its not as if they don't test them fairly regularly.
Of those who tried to win but didn't, but who have been caught, the stigma persists
for years...

Patrick Turner.