Langis wrote:

I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.


That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.) At some point in time when I get some cash flow going
I'll probably have the site redesigned more in keeping with what I think
is best.

As for the serial plate on the back, I do have a very nice gold embossed
sticker that is exactly as you describe it. In hindsight that should've
showed up on the site--it's just another point that adds credibility to
the operation. Dealing with website developers and "professional"
photographers has been a little more squirrelly than I was expecting.

On Sat, 04 Oct 2003 17:15:09 GMT, trotsky wrote:

Langis wrote:

I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.


That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.) At some point in time when I get some cash flow going
I'll probably have the site redesigned more in keeping with what I think
is best.

I think you missed his point. He's saying that you should replace the
*current* plate on the front of your speaker. I think he thinks it
would be far more attractive to have the web site logo in lieu of the
bowling trophy nameplate.

As for the serial plate on the back, I do have a very nice gold embossed
sticker that is exactly as you describe it. In hindsight that should've
showed up on the site--it's just another point that adds credibility to
the operation. Dealing with website developers and "professional"
photographers has been a little more squirrelly than I was expecting.

dave weil wrote:

On Sat, 04 Oct 2003 17:15:09 GMT, trotsky wrote:


Langis wrote:


I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.


That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.) At some point in time when I get some cash flow going
I'll probably have the site redesigned more in keeping with what I think
is best.


I think you missed his point. He's saying that you should replace the
*current* plate on the front of your speaker. I think he thinks it
would be far more attractive to have the web site logo in lieu of the
bowling trophy nameplate.



You're really getting petty now, dave.

trotsky said:

You're really getting petty now, dave.

Is "petty" the trotsky word for "oops, I've been shown up again"?

George M. Middius wrote:


trotsky said:


You're really getting petty now, dave.


Is "petty" the trotsky word for "oops, I've been shown up again"?



George, again, this is audio, which time and time again you've professed
ignorance towards. Why the pretense, buddy?

Gregipus pines for the comfort of dave weil's abuse.

Is "petty" the trotsky word for "oops, I've been shown up again"?

George, again, this is audio, which time and time again you've professed
ignorance towards. Why the pretense, buddy?

Your speakers are a ripoff. Now that we've dropped your silly
pretense of soliciting feedback from the marketplace, it's time for
everybody to admit that Bobo and Obie were right. And not just
because you're a schmuck.

George M. Middius wrote:


Gregipus pines for the comfort of dave weil's abuse.


Is "petty" the trotsky word for "oops, I've been shown up again"?



George, again, this is audio, which time and time again you've professed
ignorance towards. Why the pretense, buddy?


Your speakers are a ripoff. Now that we've dropped your silly
pretense of soliciting feedback from the marketplace, it's time for
everybody to admit that Bobo and Obie were right. And not just
because you're a schmuck.



It's sad to see you sink this low. So now you can evaluate speakers
without listening to them, like those borgs you wax vitriolic about?
Wasn't it you that said recently "you've become that which you hate," or
words to that effect?

Gregipus demonstrates his version of taking the high road.

Your speakers are a ripoff. Now that we've dropped your silly
pretense of soliciting feedback from the marketplace, it's time for
everybody to admit that Bobo and Obie were right. And not just
because you're a schmuck.

It's sad to see you sink this low. So now you can evaluate speakers
without listening to them, like those borgs you wax vitriolic about?
Wasn't it you that said recently "you've become that which you hate," or
words to that effect?

Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

Isn't it about time you chuck yourself into Lake Michigan?

"George M. Middius" wrote in message
...


Gregipus pines for the comfort of dave weil's abuse.

Is "petty" the trotsky word for "oops, I've been shown up again"?

George, again, this is audio, which time and time again you've professed
ignorance towards. Why the pretense, buddy?

Your speakers are a ripoff. Now that we've dropped your silly
pretense of soliciting feedback from the marketplace, it's time for
everybody to admit that Bobo and Obie were right. And not just
because you're a schmuck.

And I was just going to suggest, for the logo, the available Zenith motto,
"The quality goes in before the name goes on."

"trotsky" wrote in message
nk.net...
Langis wrote:

I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.


That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.)

But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has monetary
benefits?

I would make the argument on moral grounds, but it would require familiarity
with ethical concepts.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...



But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has
monetary
benefits?


A lesson which should be applied to your life experience.




----== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups
---= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

"George M. Middius" wrote in message
...


trotsky said:

You're really getting petty now, dave.

Is "petty" the trotsky word for "oops, I've been shown up again"?

For sure "petty" describes virtually everything that Middius writes and
does.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"trotsky" wrote in message
nk.net...
Langis wrote:

I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.


That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.)

But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has
monetary
benefits?

I would make the argument on moral grounds, but it would require
familiarity
with ethical concepts.

Point well taken. It is well-known that Singh ascribes to no known ethical
system other than: If I think it will give me an advantage at the moment,
I'll do it.

"Sockpuppet Yustabe" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...



But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has
monetary
benefits?


A lesson which should be applied to your life experience.

Why don't you tell us about your ethical system sockpuppet Yustabe? You
know, the one that has allowed you to aid and abet in the posting of
pedophile fantasies on RAO for years.

George M. Middius wrote:


Gregipus demonstrates his version of taking the high road.


Your speakers are a ripoff. Now that we've dropped your silly
pretense of soliciting feedback from the marketplace, it's time for
everybody to admit that Bobo and Obie were right. And not just
because you're a schmuck.



It's sad to see you sink this low. So now you can evaluate speakers
without listening to them, like those borgs you wax vitriolic about?
Wasn't it you that said recently "you've become that which you hate," or
words to that effect?


Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

Isn't it about time you chuck yourself into Lake Michigan?



George, you're looney tunes. There is no "accusation", just you
becoming borg. I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings.

Arny Krueger wrote:
"George M. Middius" wrote in message
...


trotsky said:


You're really getting petty now, dave.

Is "petty" the trotsky word for "oops, I've been shown up again"?


For sure "petty" describes virtually everything that Middius writes and
does.



And "Christian" describes what you do, right Krueger? ROTFL!!!

Arny Krueger wrote:
"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"trotsky" wrote in message
link.net...

Langis wrote:


I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.


That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.)

But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has

monetary

benefits?

I would make the argument on moral grounds, but it would require

familiarity

with ethical concepts.


Point well taken. It is well-known that Singh ascribes to no known ethical
system other than: If I think it will give me an advantage at the moment,
I'll do it.


It's nice to see the dickfors of the group talk amongst themselves.

trotsky said:

Your speakers are a ripoff.

It's sad

Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

Isn't it about time you chuck yourself into Lake Michigan?

George, you're looney tunes. There is no "accusation", just you
becoming borg.

"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.

I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings.

Then it must kill you to get out of bed in the morning, sweathog.

George M. Middius wrote:

trotsky said:


Your speakers are a ripoff.


It's sad


Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

Isn't it about time you chuck yourself into Lake Michigan?



George, you're looney tunes. There is no "accusation", just you
becoming borg.


"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.


My speakers are an exceptionally good value, which should be obvious to
anyone that hears them. Borgs tend not to worry about such things.



I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings.


Then it must kill you to get out of bed in the morning, sweathog.


And as the coup de grace, an IKYABWAI. Bob Morion couldn't have
scripted it any better.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Sockpuppet Yustabe" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...



But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has
monetary
benefits?


A lesson which should be applied to your life experience.

Why don't you tell us about your ethical system sockpuppet Yustabe? You
know, the one that has allowed you to aid and abet in the posting of
pedophile fantasies on RAO for years.



Oh, you mean the ongoing discussion initiated by YOU. They are
your fantasies, mate.




----== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups
---= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

trotsky said:

Your speakers are a ripoff.

It's sad

Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

There is no "accusation"

"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.

My speakers are an exceptionally good value

So now, by responding to the accusation, you admit there was an
accusation. Please atone for your earlier lying, sweathog. Isn't
lying a behavior you deplore in Krooger? Don't you complain about
his flouting the priniciples of his so-called religion? Did you
renounce religion because you didn't want to feel guilty about
lying?

I'm sure you won't be able to answer any of these questions. I fully
expect nothing less than one of your mindless insults. Nonetheless,
I've done what I thought was useful in highlighting your incessant
lying.

George M. Middius wrote:

trotsky said:


Your speakers are a ripoff.


It's sad


Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.


There is no "accusation"


"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.



My speakers are an exceptionally good value


So now, by responding to the accusation, you admit there was an
accusation.


No, I was responding to you troll. I do that from time to time for my
amusement.


Please atone for your earlier lying, sweathog. Isn't
lying a behavior you deplore in Krooger? Don't you complain about
his flouting the priniciples of his so-called religion? Did you
renounce religion because you didn't want to feel guilty about
lying?

I'm sure you won't be able to answer any of these questions. I fully
expect nothing less than one of your mindless insults. Nonetheless,
I've done what I thought was useful in highlighting your incessant
lying.



George, the more I hit home, the more you whine and cry about
"mindlessness" and "irrationality". It's your way of saying "No mas!
No mas!"

trotsky said:

Your speakers are a ripoff.

Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

There is no "accusation"

"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.

My speakers are an exceptionally good value

So now, by responding to the accusation, you admit there was an
accusation.

No, I was responding to you troll.

You say "speaker dealer", I say "ripoff artist". You should be
saying "Let's call the whole thing off."

"Sockpuppet Yustabe" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Sockpuppet Yustabe" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...



But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has
monetary
benefits?


A lesson which should be applied to your life experience.

Why don't you tell us about your ethical system sockpuppet Yustabe? You
know, the one that has allowed you to aid and abet in the posting of
pedophile fantasies on RAO for years.

Oh, you mean the ongoing discussion initiated by YOU.

No, the ongoing discussion of their own pedophile fantasies initiated by
Middius, Graham and Singh

They are your fantasies, mate.

Wrong again! The real problem is that casually I mentioned in passing that
I had children, and Middius, Graham and Singh started running off at the
mouth.

trotsky wrote:



George M. Middius wrote:


trotsky said:


Your speakers are a ripoff.



It's sad



Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

Isn't it about time you chuck yourself into Lake Michigan?




George, you're looney tunes. There is no "accusation", just you
becoming borg.



"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.



My speakers are an exceptionally good value, which should be obvious to
anyone that hears them. Borgs tend not to worry about such things.

Two words and a figu

Seas Charis $455

They are at LEAST comparable to your design and cost a third as much.
No Chinese/etc. built drivers either. Buy the kit, ready to assemble
in half an hour at Madisound.

Perhaps you should just buy their kit/drivers and alter it a bit -
mayeb a different cabinet and resell it under your name.

On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 13:39:45 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Wrong again! The real problem is that casually I mentioned in passing that
I had children, and Middius, Graham and Singh started running off at the
mouth.

Don't talk ********, freak. That's the only thing you've ever told the
truth about--that you've had a child.

--
td

"The Devil" wrote in message
news:dr01ov0nvj5bqstklash9aeilhfu8m0q77@rdmzrnewst xt.nz...
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 13:39:45 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Wrong again! The real problem is that casually I mentioned in passing
that
I had children, and Middius, Graham and Singh started running off at the
mouth.

Don't talk ********, freak. That's the only thing you've ever told the
truth about--that you've had a child.

"Had a child" commonly means to be the father or mother of a child. What's
wrong with that?

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"The Devil" wrote in message
news:dr01ov0nvj5bqstklash9aeilhfu8m0q77@rdmzrnewst xt.nz...
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 13:39:45 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Wrong again! The real problem is that casually I mentioned in passing
that
I had children, and Middius, Graham and Singh started running off at
the
mouth.

Don't talk ********, freak. That's the only thing you've ever told the
truth about--that you've had a child.

"Had a child" commonly means to be the father or mother of a child. What's
wrong with that?



Ok, ok, you had a child... now don't have a cow.




----== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups
---= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

George M. Middius wrote:

trotsky said:


Your speakers are a ripoff.


Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.


There is no "accusation"


"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.


My speakers are an exceptionally good value


So now, by responding to the accusation, you admit there was an
accusation.



No, I was responding to you troll.


You say "speaker dealer", I say "ripoff artist". You should be
saying "Let's call the whole thing off."



For the record, are you admitting to borg like behavior?

Langis wrote:
trotsky wrote:


I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.

That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.) At some point in time when I get some cash flow going
I'll probably have the site redesigned more in keeping with what I think
is best.


Dave is right - I meant it would look better if you used the logo from
your site (which does look like a professional job) on the speakers. I
don't think it's a trivial point either, this is about perception of
your product - a critical matter.


Well, I disagree on all counts. First of all, I already knew what you
were trying to say, so the only thing dave was right about was restating
the obvious. Second, I had already spent over three hundred bucks on
nameplates, and was hardly going to get new ones made at this juncture.
It's not unusual for a company to redesign their logos as time passes,
of course. But the most important point is that I don't even agree with
you about the look of the logo: my logo that's currently on the speakers
is in keeping with the straight lines and no-nonsense look of the
speaker. And it looks quite good in the flesh, despite dave's cheap
shot to the contrary.


I also think the photographs on your site don't do the business
justice. They are very professionally done, no question about that -
but the trumpet and vase of flowers are *really* corny. It's a
perception issue again, but these photos do not spell out (to me)
'innovation'. If I was in your shoes I would consider using more
unusual angles, a blurred or obscured background (rather than obvious
backdrop), or better yet beg the use of a cutting edge designer home
for a real world setting, as you might see in the glossies.


I don't doubt there is room for improvement, but whose going to do the
improving? I don't have the time or money to shop around for multiple
photographers and multiple web designers--I'm actually quite please what
has transpired considering this is the first time I've ever done
anything like this. Also, I'd like to know what you're basis for
comparison is: most sites from guys flying solo like myself (Ellis, for
example) look like a trained ape made them compared to mine.


As for the serial plate on the back, I do have a very nice gold embossed
sticker that is exactly as you describe it. In hindsight that should've
showed up on the site--it's just another point that adds credibility to
the operation.


Agree with that.


Dealing with website developers and "professional"
photographers has been a little more squirrelly than I was expecting.


Curious. How were they difficult?


That's not really a suitable subject for the newsgroup. I can tell you
about it privately if you'd like. I'm already sick of people nitpicking
and whining about efforts that I've made that are far beyond anything
they will have the guts to do in their entire lives.

Arny Krueger wrote:
"Sockpuppet Yustabe" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Sockpuppet Yustabe" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

But this time, it's costing you money.
Has it ever occurred to you that being perceived as a nice guy has

monetary

benefits?


A lesson which should be applied to your life experience.

Why don't you tell us about your ethical system sockpuppet Yustabe? You
know, the one that has allowed you to aid and abet in the posting of
pedophile fantasies on RAO for years.


Oh, you mean the ongoing discussion initiated by YOU.


No, the ongoing discussion of their own pedophile fantasies initiated by
Middius, Graham and Singh


They are your fantasies, mate.


Wrong again! The real problem is that casually I mentioned in passing that
I had children, and Middius, Graham and Singh started running off at the
mouth.



Well, when you used the word "had" you did mean sexually, right?

Joseph Oberlander wrote:
trotsky wrote:



George M. Middius wrote:


trotsky said:


Your speakers are a ripoff.




It's sad




Inability to answer the accusation noted. Intellectual vapidity
noted. Moral degradation noted.

Isn't it about time you chuck yourself into Lake Michigan?





George, you're looney tunes. There is no "accusation", just you
becoming borg.




"Your speakers are a ripoff." Perhaps you thought that was a
compliment.




My speakers are an exceptionally good value, which should be obvious
to anyone that hears them. Borgs tend not to worry about such things.


Two words and a figu

Seas Charis $455

They are at LEAST comparable to your design and cost a third as much.
No Chinese/etc. built drivers either. Buy the kit, ready to assemble
in half an hour at Madisound.

Perhaps you should just buy their kit/drivers and alter it a bit -
mayeb a different cabinet and resell it under your name.


Let me know if you ever grow the necessary genitalia to buy some
speakers yourself, Joe.

On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 18:19:29 -0400, "Sockpuppet Yustabe"
wrote:


"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"The Devil" wrote in message
news:dr01ov0nvj5bqstklash9aeilhfu8m0q77@rdmzrnewst xt.nz...
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 13:39:45 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Wrong again! The real problem is that casually I mentioned in passing
that
I had children, and Middius, Graham and Singh started running off at
the
mouth.

Don't talk ********, freak. That's the only thing you've ever told the
truth about--that you've had a child.

"Had a child" commonly means to be the father or mother of a child. What's
wrong with that?



Ok, ok, you had a child... now don't have a cow.

Or a sheep, as the case may be.

On Mon, 06 Oct 2003 02:11:59 GMT, trotsky wrote:



Langis wrote:
trotsky wrote:


I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.

That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that ever
stop me before.) At some point in time when I get some cash flow going
I'll probably have the site redesigned more in keeping with what I think
is best.


Dave is right - I meant it would look better if you used the logo from
your site (which does look like a professional job) on the speakers. I
don't think it's a trivial point either, this is about perception of
your product - a critical matter.


Well, I disagree on all counts. First of all, I already knew what you
were trying to say, so the only thing dave was right about was restating
the obvious.

Except that your language failed you. Sound familiar?

Second, I had already spent over three hundred bucks on
nameplates, and was hardly going to get new ones made at this juncture.
It's not unusual for a company to redesign their logos as time passes,
of course. But the most important point is that I don't even agree with
you about the look of the logo: my logo that's currently on the speakers
is in keeping with the straight lines and no-nonsense look of the
speaker. And it looks quite good in the flesh, despite dave's cheap
shot to the contrary.

If you like cheap bowling trophies, of course.

dave weil wrote:

On Mon, 06 Oct 2003 02:11:59 GMT, trotsky wrote:



Langis wrote:

trotsky wrote:



I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.

That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that
ever
stop me before.) At some point in time when I get some cash flow
going
I'll probably have the site redesigned more in keeping with what I
think
is best.


Dave is right - I meant it would look better if you used the logo from
your site (which does look like a professional job) on the speakers. I
don't think it's a trivial point either, this is about perception of
your product - a critical matter.


Well, I disagree on all counts. First of all, I already knew what you
were trying to say, so the only thing dave was right about was restating
the obvious.


Except that your language failed you. Sound familiar?



Not really. I don't see multiple interpretations of "I already had the
logos done before the website..."--do you?

Langis wrote:

trotsky wrote:


I think it would better if you used the Jupiter graphic logo (from
your site) on the front. You presumably put a serial plate on the back
- the full name, db ratings etc, could go there.

That's a valid point--except that I already had the logos done before
the website was made. I could've demanded that the logo from the
speaker be used on the site, but since I've never done this kind of
thing before I didn't want to sound ****y. (I know--when did that
ever
stop me before.) At some point in time when I get some cash flow
going
I'll probably have the site redesigned more in keeping with what I
think
is best.

Dave is right - I meant it would look better if you used the logo from
your site (which does look like a professional job) on the speakers. I
don't think it's a trivial point either, this is about perception of
your product - a critical matter.


Well, I disagree on all counts. First of all, I already knew what you
were trying to say, so the only thing dave was right about was restating
the obvious.


I think "I could've demanded that the logo from the speaker be used on
the site" had us both confused. It's the direct opposite of what I
said.



As I told dave, I think there's only one way to interpret "I already had
the logos done before the website..."





Second, I had already spent over three hundred bucks on
nameplates, and was hardly going to get new ones made at this juncture.
It's not unusual for a company to redesign their logos as time passes,
of course. But the most important point is that I don't even agree with
you about the look of the logo: my logo that's currently on the speakers
is in keeping with the straight lines and no-nonsense look of the
speaker. And it looks quite good in the flesh, despite dave's cheap
shot to the contrary.


OK, you disagree. I maintain that the logo from your website could
look far more professional on the speakers than the nameplates, to the
degree that it could influence potential customers perception of the
product.



I think you're putting too much stock in the look. It's all about the
buzz that's created on the internet--I just have to get some customers
testimonials and/or reviews. So far everybody I've talked to about
reviews has had a "don't call us, we'll call you" attitude, but reviews
are actually the less desirable of the two.


One thing you could do without further expense is relocate the plates.
They look a bit weird being so close to the bottom IMO. Perhaps you
could stick 'em round the back? ;-)


I'll take that under consideration.


I also think the photographs on your site don't do the business
justice. They are very professionally done, no question about that -
but the trumpet and vase of flowers are *really* corny. It's a
perception issue again, but these photos do not spell out (to me)
'innovation'. If I was in your shoes I would consider using more
unusual angles, a blurred or obscured background (rather than obvious
backdrop), or better yet beg the use of a cutting edge designer home
for a real world setting, as you might see in the glossies.


I don't doubt there is room for improvement, but whose going to do the
improving? I don't have the time or money to shop around for multiple
photographers and multiple web designers--


Weird answer. If the photographer *insists* on photographing the
speakers like a bowl of fruit, it's a false economy not to find
another. You ask for what you want and they do it.. right?


Perhaps you can provide a link to a photo or photos that you think are
better.


I'm actually quite please what
has transpired considering this is the first time I've ever done
anything like this. Also, I'd like to know what you're basis for
comparison is: most sites from guys flying solo like myself (Ellis, for
example) look like a trained ape made them compared to mine.


I believe I already praised you for your first efforts.

My basis for comparison would be any impressive or professional
looking site.



Which is certainly valid, but as far as audio is concerned, I'm already
well ahead of the curve. Granted there's always room for improvement.
All it takes is cash.


As for the serial plate on the back, I do have a very nice gold
embossed
sticker that is exactly as you describe it. In hindsight that
should've
showed up on the site--it's just another point that adds
credibility to
the operation.


Agree with that.



Dealing with website developers and "professional"
photographers has been a little more squirrelly than I was expecting.


Curious. How were they difficult?


That's not really a suitable subject for the newsgroup. I can tell you
about it privately if you'd like.


Yes, do.


I'm already sick of people nitpicking
and whining about efforts that I've made that are far beyond anything
they will have the guts to do in their entire lives.


"people" in this case obviously refers to me,



No, I didn't mean that--I meant the usual suspects: Krueger, Morion,
ScottW, McKelvy, Oberlander, and, unfortunately, dave weil at this juncture.


yet your snide remark is
unfounded - I have had the guts to market a commercial product before,
and I learned a lot in doing so. I'm sorry for you if you think I'm
nitpicking - I've been impressed with what you have done so far and my
comments are constructive.



The only beef I have with you, PD, is that you didn't apply the same
scrutiny to weil's attempt at a review as you did with my efforts. In
fact, I think you totally gave him a free pass, which is unfair. Beyond
that, I really do welcome feedback that I deem to be credible, which
yours certainly is.

trotsky wrote:

Perhaps you can provide a link to a photo or photos that you think are
better.


The following picture will better characterize your high technology skill.
The artistic level will perfectly fit the high-end design of your
products, especially your "Subterfuge".

http://www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/trex/images/arttwo.jpg

Yours faithfully,
Lionel

On Mon, 06 Oct 2003 10:21:52 GMT, trotsky wrote:

The only beef I have with you, PD, is that you didn't apply the same
scrutiny to weil's attempt at a review as you did with my efforts. In
fact, I think you totally gave him a free pass, which is unfair. Beyond
that, I really do welcome feedback that I deem to be credible, which
yours certainly is.

What was wrong with dave's review? You asked him to be honest about
his findings, didn't you? So what exactly has he done wrong--besides
not kiss your arse? You were quiet when dave was positive or neutral
in his comments, but as soon as he moved on to talk about your
speakers in the context of his impressions of other speakers, your
mood soured.

I mean, you actually complained to him that he wasn't focusing enough
on the Europa's strengths.

Whose review was this, again?

Are you going to have a petulant fit of control-freakery each time a
reviewer describes your speakers in language you dislike or wish to
outlaw from 'legitimate'* audio discussions? For example, it has
become apparent that the Europas lack the bass extension and power
necessary to convey the energy of a rock performance. dave used the
age old euphemism 'lean' to describe the bass aspect of your
speakers--which as we all know really means that bass extension is
lacking (which is not to say that what's available isn't good--or even
the best). You have yourself said the bass drops off 'like a stone'
below 50Hz. So why bitch about him saying the bass is lean, if that is
his impression of it and dave knows how audiophiles will interpret
that comment?

I mean really, Greg. You've totally ****ed yourself over this whole
thing. You have cast yourself in a dreadful light. I don't think
anyone who has followed this would want to buy speakers from you, not
least because you have shown what a revolting **** of an individual
you become when someone disagrees with you.

How will you react when a reviewer says the Europas are not actually
as good as speakers that cost ten times as much. Or maybe half as
much? What about if a reviewer should say that your speakers aren't
actually as extraordinary as you, their loving father, thinks they
are?

You'll fail at this, Greg. I think everyone sees it except you. You
should buy some cakes (English scones, perhaps). At least get some
satisfaction out of your money while it lasts.

--
td

* Meaning what you say is legitimate.

"dave weil" wrote in message

On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 18:19:29 -0400, "Sockpuppet Yustabe"
wrote:


"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"The Devil" wrote in message
news:dr01ov0nvj5bqstklash9aeilhfu8m0q77@rdmzrnewst xt.nz...
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003 13:39:45 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Wrong again! The real problem is that casually I mentioned in
passing that I had children, and Middius, Graham and Singh
started running off at
the
mouth.

Don't talk ********, freak. That's the only thing you've ever told
the truth about--that you've had a child.

"Had a child" commonly means to be the father or mother of a child.
What's wrong with that?



Ok, ok, you had a child... now don't have a cow.

Or a sheep, as the case may be.

Speak for yourself, Weil.

On Mon, 06 Oct 2003 09:50:09 GMT, trotsky wrote:

Not really. I don't see multiple interpretations of "I already had the
logos done before the website..."--do you?

When coupled with the phrase "I could've demanded that the logo from
the speaker be used on the site", yes I do.