New Sensor have just anounced their new EH KT90,
selling for usd $29 each, measuring better than originals, they say.

Don't ask me why they are so much more expensive than KT88/6550,
but then ppl with amps which take KT90 as standard will feel
less insecure about future supplies.

4 x KT90 can make 50 watts class A in triode, very nice, I heard.

Patrick Turner.

I have KT90s in my Citation II and they're very nice. I got mine from
Jim McShane a while back, so they're the older production.

Regards,

RAymond

Patrick Turner wrote:

New Sensor have just anounced their new EH KT90,
selling for usd $29 each, measuring better than originals, they say.

Don't ask me why they are so much more expensive than KT88/6550,
but then ppl with amps which take KT90 as standard will feel
less insecure about future supplies.

4 x KT90 can make 50 watts class A in triode, very nice, I heard.

Patrick Turner.

From New Sensor the trend has been higher priced products.
I think the days of dirt cheap commie tubes are over. The
TJ/Full Music tubes are another example.

On the other hand, if the quality and lifespan of their tubes
improves, the trade off could be worthwhile. I'd rather
pay a bit more for dependable tubes that will last.

I can assure you, the dealer isn't getting the lion's share of
the profits selling those tubes.

I haven't heard the NS KT90... but the EI KT90/99
were the berries when EI made them right.

A.Cirella, Handmade
www.hndme.com



"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...
New Sensor have just anounced their new EH KT90,
selling for usd $29 each, measuring better than originals, they say.

Don't ask me why they are so much more expensive than KT88/6550,
but then ppl with amps which take KT90 as standard will feel
less insecure about future supplies.

4 x KT90 can make 50 watts class A in triode, very nice, I heard.

Patrick Turner.

"A.Cirella" wrote:

From New Sensor the trend has been higher priced products.
I think the days of dirt cheap commie tubes are over. The
TJ/Full Music tubes are another example.

On the other hand, if the quality and lifespan of their tubes
improves, the trade off could be worthwhile. I'd rather
pay a bit more for dependable tubes that will last.

I can assure you, the dealer isn't getting the lion's share of
the profits selling those tubes.

I haven't heard the NS KT90... but the EI KT90/99
were the berries when EI made them right.

A.Cirella, Handmade
www.hndme.com

New Sensor are limiting KT90 to 10 per customer.

I am happy with KT88/6550 for 1/2 the price,
so I doubt I will ever buy any KT90.

Patrick Turner.



"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...
New Sensor have just anounced their new EH KT90,
selling for usd $29 each, measuring better than originals, they say.

Don't ask me why they are so much more expensive than KT88/6550,
but then ppl with amps which take KT90 as standard will feel
less insecure about future supplies.

4 x KT90 can make 50 watts class A in triode, very nice, I heard.

Patrick Turner.

"Patrick Turner" wrote...

New Sensor have just anounced their new EH
KT90, selling for usd $29 each, measuring
better than originals, they say.

Well, measurements aren't everything as we know.

I'm going to audition the EH tubes, but I have to
say they'd have to go a long way to beat a well
made Ei type II KT-90. Let alone the type IIs
I have now - WOW!

There was cooperation between David Manley
and Ei back in 1989 and 90 when the KT-90
appeared, he wanted them for VTL gear. I
suspect it was one of those "marriages made in
heaven." I still have some notes from David
when he and I were corresponding about the
KT-90, he was really excited about it.

Mike Matthews (Mr. New Sensor) also knows
the current Ei quality is so bad that he can move
on the market now before they recover and he
can win some fans in the interim. He's no dummy!

Me? I've got about 250 type IIs, they just absolutely
KILL! And by the time you add shipping and matching
for EH tubes, the price difference isn't much (and their
matching is inconsistent).

Having said all that, I'll check the EHs out. I like the
KT-88 and 6CA7 EH tubes, that's for sure!

Jim McShane
Need Tubes? Got a H-K Citation (Pre) Amp?
Check http://pages.prodigy.net/jimmcshane
Repro knobs for Citation gear in stock!

Jim McShane wrote:

"Patrick Turner" wrote...

New Sensor have just anounced their new EH
KT90, selling for usd $29 each, measuring
better than originals, they say.

Well, measurements aren't everything as we know.

Indeed.



I'm going to audition the EH tubes, but I have to
say they'd have to go a long way to beat a well
made Ei type II KT-90. Let alone the type IIs
I have now - WOW!

I haven't seen one.
Is there any difference to the original Ei?


There was cooperation between David Manley
and Ei back in 1989 and 90 when the KT-90
appeared, he wanted them for VTL gear. I
suspect it was one of those "marriages made in
heaven." I still have some notes from David
when he and I were corresponding about the
KT-90, he was really excited about it.

I wasn't a great fan of the original KT90, and I got 5pcs
to try, and all had a pretty lousy linearity curve in SEP.
SET, or UL they were OK.



Mike Matthews (Mr. New Sensor) also knows
the current Ei quality is so bad that he can move
on the market now before they recover and he
can win some fans in the interim. He's no dummy!

I tried to interest the engineer at Ei to build an indirectly heated
triode
about like the 300B, but packaged like the KT90, as a drop in
replacement for existing
amps say with EL34, and the guy said he was working on what they said
was a 400B prototype,
but nothing has come of any of this afaik.


Me? I've got about 250 type IIs, they just absolutely
KILL! And by the time you add shipping and matching
for EH tubes, the price difference isn't much (and their
matching is inconsistent).

OK, so what's so good?

Having said all that, I'll check the EHs out. I like the
KT-88 and 6CA7 EH tubes, that's for sure!

The EH KT88 and EH6550 and Sovtek KT88 appear to be exactly the
same electronically, just different glass and lettering, to make the EH
look pretty.
I have a lot of the 6CA7, which was very cheap, and I
will soon use some in a couple of SEA amps.

Patrick Turner.



Jim McShane
Need Tubes? Got a H-K Citation (Pre) Amp?
Check http://pages.prodigy.net/jimmcshane
Repro knobs for Citation gear in stock!

"Patrick Turner" wrote...

(with regard to Ei KT-90 construction)

I haven't seen one. Is there any difference
to the original Ei?

Yes. The type II has a reinforcement behind
the center section of the plate which the type I
didn't have. It also has a 50 watt dissipation
rating as opposed to the 46 watt rating of the
type I. Type III added "wings" to the plates
presumably to improve cooling.

Also the earliest tubes had more gain than
the later ones.

I wasn't a great fan of the original KT90,
and I got 5pcs to try, and all had a pretty
lousy linearity curve in SEP. SET, or UL
they were OK.

I never tried it in SEP, only in triode or UL.

I tried to interest the engineer at Ei to build
an indirectly heated triode about like the
300B, but packaged like the KT90, as a drop
in replacement for existing amps say with
EL34, and the guy said he was working on
what they said was a 400B prototype,
but nothing has come of any of this afaik.

Yep, they told me the quality of the KT-90
type III was the best ever (this was spring
2003 right after I rejected 98 out of 100
type IIIs I'd received). They can hardly
build what they have now let alone add to
the line...

OK, so what's so good? (referring to the
type II KT-90s I have)

Just read this customer quote:

"Just to let you know.... the KT90s arrived... I
put the KT90s in and biased the amps up ... they
are in triode)... and holy crap. I had heard KT90s
were nice... but I had never planned to simply
dump my Tung-Sol 6550s and never look back.
These KT90s are incredible. Mid-bass was filled
in and very authoritative... ambient information
doubled... the highs fell back and darkened a
bit (which I love) but retained plenty of velvety
crispness. Just incredible..."

Those comments aren't unusual at all Patrick. In my
own personal case, I had a quad of Genelex KT-88s
in my Citation II amp - I tried the KT-90 Ei - and
then I sold the Genelex. Never regretted it. The first
set of KT-90s I had lasted 11 years BTW.

The EH KT88 and EH6550 and Sovtek KT88
appear to be exactly the same electronically, just
different glass and lettering, to make the EH
look pretty.

I don't know, I don't carry the EH 6550 so I can't
compare side by side. Maybe somebody else
could comment.

Jim McShane
Need Tubes? Got a H-K Citation (Pre) Amp?
Check http://pages.prodigy.net/jimmcshane
Repro knobs for Citation gear in stock!

Jim McShane wrote:

"Patrick Turner" wrote...

(with regard to Ei KT-90 construction)

I haven't seen one. Is there any difference
to the original Ei?

Yes. The type II has a reinforcement behind
the center section of the plate which the type I
didn't have. It also has a 50 watt dissipation
rating as opposed to the 46 watt rating of the
type I. Type III added "wings" to the plates
presumably to improve cooling.

Also the earliest tubes had more gain than
the later ones.

I wasn't a great fan of the original KT90,
and I got 5pcs to try, and all had a pretty
lousy linearity curve in SEP. SET, or UL
they were OK.

I never tried it in SEP, only in triode or UL.

Well, they are awful in SEP, with a transfer curve like a dogs hind leg,
as they say.
If you look at the pentode plate curves, it isn't a pretty picture.



I tried to interest the engineer at Ei to build
an indirectly heated triode about like the
300B, but packaged like the KT90, as a drop
in replacement for existing amps say with
EL34, and the guy said he was working on
what they said was a 400B prototype,
but nothing has come of any of this afaik.

Yep, they told me the quality of the KT-90
type III was the best ever (this was spring
2003 right after I rejected 98 out of 100
type IIIs I'd received).

Oh dear.

I had a couple of long emails with an egineer there, about the 400B.
I got the idea he had a booze problem from the way the emails read.

But I am not surprised, since their country was bombed by Nato,
ie, by the US and poms, and after that anyone with any skill at all had
to
rebuild the country, and all that pain could lead a bloke to grog.

They can hardly
build what they have now let alone add to
the line...

OK, so what's so good? (referring to the
type II KT-90s I have)

Just read this customer quote:

"Just to let you know.... the KT90s arrived... I
put the KT90s in and biased the amps up ... they
are in triode)... and holy crap. I had heard KT90s
were nice... but I had never planned to simply
dump my Tung-Sol 6550s and never look back.
These KT90s are incredible. Mid-bass was filled
in and very authoritative... ambient information
doubled... the highs fell back and darkened a
bit (which I love) but retained plenty of velvety
crispness. Just incredible..."

Those comments aren't unusual at all Patrick.

Yes indeed. Heard it all before. Just subjective rant.

In my
own personal case, I had a quad of Genelex KT-88s
in my Citation II amp - I tried the KT-90 Ei - and
then I sold the Genelex. Never regretted it. The first
set of KT-90s I had lasted 11 years BTW.

But a pair of KT88 will do more than a single KT90.
The '90 costs twice the '88, so where is the value?



The EH KT88 and EH6550 and Sovtek KT88
appear to be exactly the same electronically, just
different glass and lettering, to make the EH
look pretty.

I don't know, I don't carry the EH 6550 so I can't
compare side by side. Maybe somebody else
could comment.

When I measured samples of the three tubes,
I got same Ra, U and Gm, and on inspection, they all looked the same
internally.

But Mike says the grid wires of the russian KT88/6550 have been
slightly altered to a larger size, to reduce thd.
But I doubt that, since Mike is a marketing man, and the grid was made
larger
to make it easier to make the tube, to fit the cathode inside, and keep
to even cathode-grid spacing. The result was slightly higher Ra, and
lower Gm.
Something has been done to the screens, compared to original genelex
KT88,
so I see the russian tubes as being real KT88 or 6550 in name only,
they are really a rationalised new design, and packaged with modern
hooha
styling to give appeal to a style oriented market.
Fortunately, the tubes seem to work OK, and give the same po and low thd

as any of the old 6550 tubes I have tried from GE.
Sovtek isn't exactly a glamarous name; Electro Harmonix rolls off the
tongue
better, and don't have the connotations of a communist state run
enterprise,
with its dark dirty environment ruining factories, with the workers
slaving away
making shoddy goods, many with vodka problems.
One wonders how the russian workers or the environment are
going right now, and how close the factories are to collapsing,
or if there is any renewal of infrastructure, which is a sign of
confidence and investment for the future, rather than just the flogging
of an old tired horse,
to make a $$$ while it lasts.

Patrick Turner.



Jim McShane
Need Tubes? Got a H-K Citation (Pre) Amp?
Check http://pages.prodigy.net/jimmcshane
Repro knobs for Citation gear in stock!

"Patrick Turner" wrote...

Well, they are awful in SEP, with a transfer curve
like a dogs hind leg, as they say. If you look at the
pentode plate curves, it isn't a pretty picture.

I disagree, not the curves I've seen.

Regarding the very positive customer comments
I posted about the Ei KT-90 type II you scribbled...

Yes indeed. Heard it all before. Just subjective rant.

So it appears that anyone who disagrees with you
is just ranting. You sure are full of yourself, yikes!
Sight unseen you've decided that gentleman (and
the many others) who wrote positive comments are
unqualified to pass judgment as to what he/they
heard and like. I think you owe him an apology.

You sure do seem to have an ego problem from
where I sit.

But a pair of KT88 will do more than a single KT90.
The '90 costs twice the '88, so where is the value?

What are you talking about? Your math is wrong, and
it's a goofy analogy anyway. Geez, who peed in your
cornflakes this morning?

At my site:

EH KT-88 quad - $99.50/quad
Ei KT-90 type II - $164.50/quad including shipping
Ei KT-90 type III - $149.50/quad including shipping

Where I went to school $150 or $165 isn't 2X $100...

(Snip about EH and Sovtek tube production and
Mike Mathews lying about the tubes they build)

Patrick, I'm finished responding to your posts. You
already have your mind made up, and your post looks
to me to have been designed only to discredit and
disparage. Nothing constructive.

When you respond with the predictable "McShane is
an incompetent idiot" post please don't forget the
apology to the customer who made the nice comments
about his KT-90 tubes. You owe him one.

Jim McShane
Need Tubes? Got a H-K Citation (Pre) Amp?
Check http://pages.prodigy.net/jimmcshane
Repro knobs for Citation gear in stock!

Jim McShane wrote:

"Patrick Turner" wrote...

Well, they are awful in SEP, with a transfer curve
like a dogs hind leg, as they say. If you look at the
pentode plate curves, it isn't a pretty picture.

I disagree, not the curves I've seen.

The Ei curves are not pretty,
and the tubes I tested in pentode
were not what I would call ideal.
But with UL, ot triode, wonderful!
Just my experience.



Regarding the very positive customer comments
I posted about the Ei KT-90 type II you scribbled...

Yes indeed. Heard it all before. Just subjective rant.

So it appears that anyone who disagrees with you
is just ranting. You sure are full of yourself, yikes!

I build amps, and have auditioned them with many audio enthusiasts
present.
There were a sea of smiles for the sound, and as many opinions
as there were ppl about "the sound".

There are very many various good natured ranters out there.
I never know if things I build will be accepted, until
I please the mob, which I assure you is a lot of work.

Sight unseen you've decided that gentleman (and
the many others) who wrote positive comments are
unqualified to pass judgment as to what he/they
heard and like. I think you owe him an apology.

I am sorry if I offended, it wasn't maliciosly intended to offend.

I will maintain that I hear different and surprising subjective
commentary
about audio equipments in general, some is quite negative, some quite
positive,
and I am loathe to accept any subjective assessment as gospel, because
the next fella I meet along the way thinks differently.



You sure do seem to have an ego problem from
where I sit.

Na, just enthusiastic about tubes.



But a pair of KT88 will do more than a single KT90.
The '90 costs twice the '88, so where is the value?

What are you talking about? Your math is wrong, and
it's a goofy analogy anyway. Geez, who peed in your
cornflakes this morning?

EH at US $29 bucks each are twice the price of sovtek KT88.
Certainly twice the price of EH6550, same as KT88, but cheaper,
and two 6550 will do more than a single KT90.
That's a fact.
The sound you may get could be argued over forever and a day,
so I call the argument rant, and look at the trouble it gets me into,
and I don't wanna side with anyone, lest they take a chunk out of the
jaw
over percieved sound quality.





At my site:

EH KT-88 quad - $99.50/quad

OK, that price is reasonable, no worries.


Ei KT-90 type II - $164.50/quad including shipping

I leave it to others to decide if its worth it.

Ei KT-90 type III - $149.50/quad including shipping

ditto.


Where I went to school $150 or $165 isn't 2X $100...

Sure, let me explain further.

I get my EH6550 for around $14, and I would get
EH KT90 for around $24 each, if I bought 10,
so its nearly a 1:2 ratio.

The 2 x 6550 would have 84 watts possible Pa max,
as opposed to 50 watts Pa of the KT90,
so based on $ per watt capability for KT90,
the '90 don't look like good value,
since I make mainly class A amps,
and a high Pa is handy to get the available class A po high.
I would doubt a pair of KT90 could produce the power of a quad of 6550,
and the premium for KT90 seems not worth it.
If a single KT90 had Pa of 70 watts, perhaps they'd be worth my
consideration on this basis, based on New Sensor bulk buy prices for
50pcs.

I think it should sell for $16each, if 50 are purchased..
I won't hold my breath.

Meanwhile, I have no dispute with folks who simply just adore the KT90
for the sound. They should buy some from you, and you'll all be happy.


(Snip about EH and Sovtek tube production and
Mike Mathews lying about the tubes they build)

I pondered marketting, but did Mike lie?
I really don't know.

Patrick, I'm finished responding to your posts. You
already have your mind made up, and your post looks
to me to have been designed only to discredit and
disparage. Nothing constructive.

Perhaps you could consider being less negative.

I only intended to inform. I had a few emails with Mike.
he told me of slight changes to the tubes in russia.
I was left hanging after I asked Mike about just what electronic
difference if any
existed between EHKT88 and EH6550, and I really don't think the remarks
he made about
thd were significant.
This became apparent when I measured
the distortion of one of my 8585 amps amp with old GE6550, and then with
the new EH6550,
which I purchased for a client to replace the GE.
The results were the same.
Luckily for me, the customer liked the switch from the GE, still quite
serviceable.
He had a good listen for 3 days, and said that not only was the sound
more dynamic, but more detailed, and that there was depth to the sound
stage,
where before there was just beautiful width.
I had also altered the circuit from the balanced screen feedback
I had sold it with to acoustical with global FB.
I am not able to discern whether the new tubes, or the circuit change
provided the miracle my client says he heard.
I doubt I will persist with the novel idea I had of balanced screen FB.

Anyway, Mike never fully answered my questions. I gave up.
Their tubes comply with the expected abilities of
any NOS KT88 or 6550, and I get good feedback from my clients,
so I don't need to pressure them for
any more attention or info than they were prepared to donate.
I satisfied myself that the EH 6550 was suitable for what I wanted,
since I carefully measured a few I have.
I take nothing for granted.
I remain one of their favoured customers.
I have never had a dud tube from them.


When you respond with the predictable "McShane is
an incompetent idiot" post please don't forget the
apology to the customer who made the nice comments
about his KT-90 tubes. You owe him one.

Please convey my sincerest apologies to the guy who I offended.

And you Mr McShane, are not an incompetant idiot.

We will all have different opinions.
If anyone enters discussions here, they must be prepared for them.
That your opinion differs from mine doesn't mean I think that you
have a big ego, or that I don't like you.

I will keep you in mind if I need to buy some tubes from you.

Have a great weekend,
We have some warm but stormy weather here.

I guess your autumn brings ideas to
keep the home triodes burning.

Patrick Turner.





Jim McShane
Need Tubes? Got a H-K Citation (Pre) Amp?
Check http://pages.prodigy.net/jimmcshane
Repro knobs for Citation gear in stock!