The Krooborg's guts are churning.

Sighted Listening tests - the same technology

Thanks for admitting Mr. Krooborg that you have no idea what "technology" means.

" wrote in message
k.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"sam" wrote in message
...
" wrote

I'm getting tired of this discussion, Mike. Haven't we been all the
way
around it?
Only because you don't seem to want to acknowledge you have a claim
with
no evidence.


What claim is that? The one you agree with?

Sam, you're arguing with something at the level of machine intelligence.
Mikey's mantra is that he must repeat this lie, because it helps him
believe
he knows some little piece of valuable knowledge.
The world is littered with broken minds, mental machinery that belongs
in
a
dump, if it isn't already there.

Could you put yourself out on the curb, we'll have you picked up and
disposed of, along with all the other anti-reason, audio trash.

I give Mikey a theme, and he runs with it

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"arny krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" blatantly lied in message
...

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of second-rate
parts,
cheapo sound card and undersized relays, people were talking about
differences they hear.

Fact of the matter is that I assembled my first ABX box in the middle
1970s
when there were no sound cards - and not really any PCs, either.

The relays were far from being undersized -they were if anything
oversized.

The parts were mostly mil-spec. For example all of the relays ran off
of
28
volts DC, because that was the military standard at the time.

And that doesn't make all that has gone before false. It's as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a mixture. What
people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true, false, and
imagination.
But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that isn't a simple
"fact."

Muddled thinking, anybody?

Realistic, not simplistic.

It's quite amazing how being caught in three lies in quick succession
doesn't phase you, Robert. How do you sear your conscience so thoroughly?

Mikey, pay attention. This is an example of what we're trying to get you out
of.

Robert Morein wrote:
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"arny krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" blatantly lied in message
...

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of second-rate
parts,
cheapo sound card and undersized relays, people were talking about
differences they hear.

Fact of the matter is that I assembled my first ABX box in the middle
1970s
when there were no sound cards - and not really any PCs, either.

The relays were far from being undersized -they were if anything
oversized.

The parts were mostly mil-spec. For example all of the relays ran off
of
28
volts DC, because that was the military standard at the time.

And that doesn't make all that has gone before false. It's as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a mixture. What
people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true, false, and
imagination.
But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that isn't a simple
"fact."

Muddled thinking, anybody?

Realistic, not simplistic.

It's quite amazing how being caught in three lies in quick succession
doesn't phase you, Robert. How do you sear your conscience so thoroughly?

Mikey, pay attention. This is an example of what we're trying to get you out
of.


Morein, you become more like a low-rez copy of "Middius" with each
passing day.


There's something to look forward to: being a cheesy copy of a
psychotic asshole. :-O

wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in message
oups.com...
wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in message
ups.com...
wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in message
oups.com...
So I ask again: your poor memory for your own actions
notwithstanding, why, in the face of the evidence that I haven't
done the things Arny accuses me of, do you cling to your faith
that Arny has never told a "flat-out lie"...

I won't comment on it until or unless I review the context of
the discussion.

What's to review?

Context. Look it up.

Okay, you've now had, what, two days to examine the context.
How about an answer to my question, Mr. McKelvy.

What makes you think I spend my free time, my liesure time trying
to figure out who's telling the truth.

I assumed, Mr. McKelvy, that because you introduced this topic, you
were indeed willing to spend your free time, your leisure time,
figuring out who was telling the truth. It hardly seem fair for
to complain about having the burden of proof in connection with
as subject _you_ raised.

You made an an unambiguous, unqualified statement that "Arny
Krueger has never told a flat-out lie."

That I am awarre of.

Okay, as there is no factual evidence in the Google record
for the untrue statements Arny Krueger has made about me,
why are you relying on faith as support for your claim
that "Arny Krueger has never told a flat-out lie."

I made that statement before you mentioned the alleged lies.

No, you made a few days after my last mention of the untruths,
in a thread to which you were contributing, and what, six weeks,
after you last discussed the matter with me.

I don't see any reason to investigate your personal feud, at
least not at this time, particularly since the only reason you
bring it up is to take the spotlight off yourself, and your
con game magazine.

Regardless of your incorrect guesses about my motives, Mr.
Mckelvy, this is about a matter of logic, about sorting
facts from faith. You have been very quick to claim that you
are only intersted in facts, yet when I have showed you that
you claim about Mr. Krueger's lack of mendacity is not
supported by the evidence in the Google record, you can
neither support what you said, nor withdraw it. Instead,
you indulge yourself in name-calling.

All I am saying Mr. McKelvy, is that as shown by this exchange,
your position is based on faith alone. Which is ironic indeed,
given your pronouncements. :-)

why you can't hire people who won't get into screaming matches
in public, like Fremer did with Nousaine?

I am not aware of this happening, Mr. McKelvy. More faith-based
projection on your part, I suggest.

Fremer does work for you right? Did you ask him? Nousaine reported
it in the Audio Critic.

Can you give a reference, please.

No response from Mr. McKelvy. Why is is so hard for you believers
in "Scientism" ever to substantiate what you say, Mr. McKelvy? This
is a reasonable request, I thought: you made a claim about the
behavior of one of my writers; I would like to be able to read for
myself what Tom Nousaine wrote. Why are you afraid of me doing so?

snip of more namecalling

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

George Middius wrote:
EnvyBorg turns green.

Nice impersonation, George.

Nice suck-up job, Paul.

Can anybody remember the last time somebody complimented
Arnii for being clever? Anybody? Anybody at all.....?

Middius if you're so clever and interesting, why didn't
Atkinson debate you at the HE2005 show?

George Middius wrote:
Mickey, have you been chasing your cockroach platter with
toad skins?

Arny Krueger
drowned out Michael's comments by repeatedly screaming
"demonstration" at which Michael also started screaming.

Fremer likes to scream when challenged. He doesn't
handle the truth very well.

Has anybody else noticed how difficult it is to predict
the next impossibly stupid thing Mikey will say?

What's wrong with what Mikey said?

Based on personal, face-to-face experience Fremer is quite
hysterical, as his obsession with a 17-year-old listening
test demonstrates quite nicely.

Middius, when is the last time you had a face-to-face
disagreement with Fremer?

Mike McKelvy wrote:

I don't see any reason to investigate your personal feud [with Arny Krueger], at
least not at this time, particularly since the only reason you
bring it up is to take the spotlight off yourself, and your
con game magazine.


The Slimey Limey lied:

Regardless of your incorrect guesses about my motives


"incorrect guesses about [your] motives" ??? LOL! The fact that you
are, indeed, attempting to divert attention away from your sleazy, con
game publication and toward the minutia of your personal feud with Arny
Krueger is painfully obvious.

"John Atkinson" wrote
in message
oups.com

I assumed, Mr. McKelvy, that because you introduced this
topic, you were indeed willing to spend your free time,
your leisure time, figuring out who was telling the
truth. It hardly seem fair for to complain about having
the burden of proof in
connection with as subject _you_ raised.

Given your recent and past deceptive behaviour Atkinson, why
are you trying to shame yourself further by sending someone
on a quest for truth? The truth is obvious to many - your
ragazine uses the truth only as a guardian of a large number
of commercially-expedient falsehoods. The sighted listening
tests that your magazine promotes have given us such
sterling examples of snake oil such as Green CD pens,
Shakti stones and Mpingo disks.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"arny krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" blatantly lied
in message ...

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of
second-rate parts, cheapo sound card and undersized
relays, people were talking about differences they
hear.

Fact of the matter is that I assembled my first ABX
box in the middle 1970s
when there were no sound cards - and not really any
PCs, either.

The relays were far from being undersized -they were
if anything oversized.

The parts were mostly mil-spec. For example all of the
relays ran off of 28
volts DC, because that was the military standard at
the time.

And that doesn't make all that has gone before false.
It's as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a
mixture. What people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true,
false, and imagination. But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that
isn't a simple "fact."

Muddled thinking, anybody?

Realistic, not simplistic.

It's quite amazing how being caught in three lies in
quick succession doesn't phase you, Robert. How do you
sear your conscience so thoroughly?

Mikey, pay attention. This is an example of what we're
trying to get you out of.

So Morein, what's wrong with publishing a public correction
of three of your more recent lies?

More feces from the King of ****.

Can anybody remember the last time somebody complimented
Arnii for being clever? Anybody? Anybody at all.....?

Middius if you're so clever and interesting, why didn't
Atkinson debate you at the HE2005 show?

God, you are so desperate. Doesn't the Big Sleep appeal to you at all?

KrazyBorg begs for pity.

John seems to want everybody to think that he's so gentle that butter won't
melt in his mouth. But he has shown his true personality in the past with
posts like this one:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...74d1ae24a1ed78

"Except that I didn't deny accusing Mr. Krueger of plagiarism. Instead
I voiced my suspicion that Mr. Krueger is insane.

Mr. ****, could you please explain how that reflects badly on his
character? To me it seem just an opinion. Calling you a liar and a
hypocrite, while thoroughly justified by the evidence, could at least be
construed as insulting. But merely observing that you seem to be insane
doesn't meet that test.

Here's a riddle for you: If you weren't crazy, you wouldn't suffer from
the delusion that pointing out your craziness is an attack on you.

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"John Atkinson" wrote in message
oups.com...

wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in message
ups.com...

wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in message
oups.com...
So I ask again: your poor memory for your own actions
notwithstanding, why, in the face of the evidence that I haven't
done the things Arny accuses me of, do you cling to your faith
that Arny has never told a "flat-out lie"...

I won't comment on it until or unless I review the context of the
discussion.

What's to review?

Context. Look it up.

Okay, you've now had, what, two days to examine the context.
How about an answer to my question, Mr. McKelvy.

What makes you think I spend my free time, my liesure time trying to
figure out who's telling the truth.


You made an an unambiguous, unqualified
statement that "Arny Krueger has never told a flat-out lie."

That I am awarre of.

Okay, as there is no factual evidence in the Google record
for the untrue statements Arny Krueger has made about me,
why are you relying on faith as support for your claim
that "Arny Krueger has never told a flat-out lie."

I made that statement before you mentioned the alleged lies.
I don't see any reason to investigate your personal feud, at least not aty
this time, particularly since the only reason you bring it up is to take
the spotlight off yourself, and your con game magazine.

why you can't hire people who won't get into screaming matches in
public, like Fremer did with Nousaine?

I am not aware of this happening, Mr. McKelvy. More faith-based
projection on your part, I suggest.

Fremer does work for you right? Did you ask him? Nousaine reported
it in the Audio Critic.

Can you give a reference, please.

Yes, Michael Fremer did get
into a shouting match with Arny Krueger at HE2005, but that
was because Mr. Krueger started screaming "Demonstration" at
the top of his voice, drowning out Mr. Fremer's reporting of
having achieved what he felt to be identification in a
blind test of amplifiers that took place at the 1988 AES
convention.

So Arny wanted proof, what a *******/

Michael was offering what he felt was proof.

Bull****, he was offering an unsupported anedcote.

Arny Krueger
drowned out Michael's comments by repeatedly screaming
"demonstration" at which Michael also started screaming.

Fremer likes to scream when challenged. He doesn't handle the truth very
well.

When are you going to admit that you and all the other clowns at SP
already know that ABX is quite suitable for determing subtle differences
and that in most cases there really aren't any?

Shall we call you Dr. Zaius from now on?


You have just been elevated to the post of
amateur audio clown. congratulations!
It is not too late to upgrade to professional status,
assuming you can meet the 'rigorous' qualifications.



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"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...


I don't see any reason to investigate your personal feud, at least not at
this time, particularly since the only reason you bring it up is to take
the spotlight off yourself, and your con game magazine.

Good call.

John seems to want everybody to think that he's so gentle that butter
won't melt in his mouth. But he has shown his true personality in the past
with posts like this one:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...74d1ae24a1ed78

"Except that I didn't deny accusing Mr. Krueger of plagiarism. Instead
I voiced my suspicion that Mr. Krueger is insane.

"Insane. Or at least delusional.

"Insane. Or at least someone who believes he can read minds.

"Insane

"Insane, Or at least paranoid.

"Perhaps dangerously paranoid.


INSANE! Most definitely you are insane.



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"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
George Middius wrote:
Mickey, have you been chasing your cockroach platter with
toad skins?

Arny Krueger
drowned out Michael's comments by repeatedly screaming
"demonstration" at which Michael also started screaming.

Fremer likes to scream when challenged. He doesn't
handle the truth very well.

Has anybody else noticed how difficult it is to predict
the next impossibly stupid thing Mikey will say?

What's wrong with what Mikey said?

Based on personal, face-to-face experience Fremer is quite hysterical, as
his obsession with a 17-year-old listening test demonstrates quite nicely.


"At least" he is not like you, obsessed with
17 year old boys taking listening tests
in your basement.



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" wrote in message
k.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"sam" wrote in message
...
" wrote

I'm getting tired of this discussion, Mike. Haven't we been all the
way
around it?
Only because you don't seem to want to acknowledge you have a claim
with
no evidence.


What claim is that? The one you agree with?

Sam, you're arguing with something at the level of machine intelligence.
Mikey's mantra is that he must repeat this lie, because it helps him
believe
he knows some little piece of valuable knowledge.
The world is littered with broken minds, mental machinery that belongs in
a
dump, if it isn't already there.

Could you put yourself out on the curb, we'll have you picked up and
disposed of, along with all the other anti-reason, audio trash.


"The typical tactic from someone who already knows he's lost. Claim the
opponent is inferior or defective. Demean them and maybe it won't make you
feel like such an idiot, even though you've demonstrated repeatedly that you
are simply a sore loser."

Mike Mckelvy, three minutes after writing the above, LOL!



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"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
George Middius wrote:
EnvyBorg turns green.

Nice impersonation, George.

Nice suck-up job, Paul.

Can anybody remember the last time somebody complimented
Arnii for being clever? Anybody? Anybody at all.....?

Middius if you're so clever and interesting, why didn't Atkinson debate
you at the HE2005 show?


Because he wanted to debate an insane person.



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"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Robert Morein" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"arny krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" blatantly lied
in message ...

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of
second-rate parts, cheapo sound card and undersized
relays, people were talking about differences they
hear.

Fact of the matter is that I assembled my first ABX
box in the middle 1970s
when there were no sound cards - and not really any
PCs, either.

The relays were far from being undersized -they were
if anything oversized.

The parts were mostly mil-spec. For example all of the
relays ran off of 28
volts DC, because that was the military standard at
the time.

And that doesn't make all that has gone before false.
It's as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a
mixture. What people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true,
false, and imagination. But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that
isn't a simple "fact."

Muddled thinking, anybody?

Realistic, not simplistic.

It's quite amazing how being caught in three lies in
quick succession doesn't phase you, Robert. How do you
sear your conscience so thoroughly?

Mikey, pay attention. This is an example of what we're
trying to get you out of.

So Morein, what's wrong with publishing a public correction
of three of your more recent lies?

Mikey, this is how you learned to post. There are better human beings to
copy.

" wrote in message
k.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"George Middius" wrote in message
...

[snip]
I'm open to discussing anything for which there is evidence. Merely
speculating that there might be something we don't know about listening
is
nothing but mental masturbation, and a pointless excercise.

The pro ABX side presents evidence, teh anti-ABX side presents
rhetoric,
most of it pointlessly nasty.

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of second-rate parts,
cheapo sound card and undersized relays, people were talking about
differences they hear.

And he was one of them. He put the abx box together to prove that
differences DO exist, you ****ing moron.

He is a mere pseudoscientist, a poseur, a fraud, and
a charlatan. And that doesn't make all that has gone before false. It's
as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a mixture. What people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true, false, and imagination.
But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that isn't a simple
"fact."


You can't seem to get your head around the fact that things either sound
different or not. There are reliable ways to discover if there are
differences, and one of them is ABX.

You chose to "follow" Arny because you are a born follower. You never
had
an
original thought in your head. And unfortunately, you picked the wrong
person to follow.

A. I'm not following him, we simply agree on the validity of DBT's for
audio.
B. I have original thoughts all the time, just not about a hack like you.
C. You don't know science any better than you know the law or the size of
that telescope.

What is this thing about a telescope?

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"ScottW" wrote in message
news:%ciLe.359$Ji.305@lakeread02...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

I'm sorry nothing can be done about your heredity.

Sounds rather bigoted to me.

ScottW

I'm sorry. Mikey is "special."

The typical tactic from someone who already knows he's lost. Claim the
opponent is inferior or defective. Demean them and maybe it won't make
you
feel like such an idiot, even though you've demonstrated repeatedly that
you
are simply a sore loser.

I'm sorry, Mikey. There really are dumb people in the world, and you're one
of them. There is a certain dullness about you, a slowness, a clumsiness of
your mental machinery. You are just not very smart.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
George Middius wrote:
EnvyBorg turns green.

Nice impersonation, George.

Nice suck-up job, Paul.

Can anybody remember the last time somebody complimented
Arnii for being clever? Anybody? Anybody at all.....?

Middius if you're so clever and interesting, why didn't
Atkinson debate you at the HE2005 show?

Arny, he felt you were worth destroying. But when he had you in his sights,
Atkinson's tender mercies let you live.
We made the same mistake with Osama Bin Laden.
We made the same

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 18:12:51 GMT, "
wrote:


Many pieces of audio gear sound the same.

Is that really true? I mean, if dogs can detect smells we have no hope
of detecting, maybe there are sound quality differences some of us are
not equipped to detect, and some of us are. Maybe all audio gear
sounds different, but only some can detect it. In which case the
argument will go on ad infinitum, and Arnie's infernal box will never
settle it. What Arnie needs to invent is a large bionic ear with
supersonic hearing, which upon detecting distortion or colouration
beyond a certain point, will immediately fire a large calibre bullet
into the casing of the unit in question, and a smaller calibre bullet
into the head of the designer. That would certainly mean an
exponential improvement in hi-fi generally over a short period.

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 14:00:57 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:


"paul packer" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 07:40:12 -0400, George M. Middius cmndr
[underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote:

Because Mr. Pocker its like you think you, can reject test's without any
sicccnecicctfic evadence. Thats called niavate. Thanks Mr. Picker for
admitting that you're against sicennece. LOt"S! ;-)

Nice impersonation, George.

Nice suck-up job, Paul.

That interpretation is your prerogative, Arnie. It just happens to be
wrong, like nearly everything else you've said lately.

"Clyde Slick" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
George Middius wrote:
EnvyBorg turns green.

Nice impersonation, George.

Nice suck-up job, Paul.

Can anybody remember the last time somebody complimented
Arnii for being clever? Anybody? Anybody at all.....?

Middius if you're so clever and interesting, why didn't Atkinson debate
you at the HE2005 show?


Because he wanted to debate an insane person.


Greg Singh wasn't available?

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...


I don't see any reason to investigate your personal feud, at least not at
this time, particularly since the only reason you bring it up is to take
the spotlight off yourself, and your con game magazine.

Good call.

John seems to want everybody to think that he's so gentle that butter
won't melt in his mouth. But he has shown his true personality in the past
with posts like this one:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...74d1ae24a1ed78

"Except that I didn't deny accusing Mr. Krueger of plagiarism. Instead
I voiced my suspicion that Mr. Krueger is insane.

"Insane. Or at least delusional.

"Insane. Or at least someone who believes he can read minds.

"Insane

"Insane, Or at least paranoid.

"Perhaps dangerously paranoid.
Oh well, he's obvioously ever so much more refined than youse. :-)

"John Atkinson" wrote in message
oups.com...

wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in message
oups.com...
wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in message
ups.com...
wrote:
"John Atkinson" wrote in
message
oups.com...
So I ask again: your poor memory for your own actions
notwithstanding, why, in the face of the evidence that I haven't
done the things Arny accuses me of, do you cling to your faith
that Arny has never told a "flat-out lie"...

I won't comment on it until or unless I review the context of
the discussion.

What's to review?

Context. Look it up.

Okay, you've now had, what, two days to examine the context.
How about an answer to my question, Mr. McKelvy.

What makes you think I spend my free time, my liesure time trying
to figure out who's telling the truth.

I assumed, Mr. McKelvy, that because you introduced this topic, you
were indeed willing to spend your free time, your leisure time,
figuring out who was telling the truth.

It's an audio NG that's what I'm most concerned with. While I may
particpate in some of the rabble rousing, it's not often that I feel the
need to use Google to figure out who said what, when, or who is more honest.
In the area of audio, Arny gets a very high score. You get bupkis. Your
magazine is a promoter of fraudulent merchandise, your reviewers should all
have either their heads or their ears examined. In Fremer's case, both.



It hardly seem fair for
to complain about having the burden of proof in connection with
as subject _you_ raised.

You made an an unambiguous, unqualified statement that "Arny
Krueger has never told a flat-out lie."

That I am awarre of.

Okay, as there is no factual evidence in the Google record
for the untrue statements Arny Krueger has made about me,
why are you relying on faith as support for your claim
that "Arny Krueger has never told a flat-out lie."

I made that statement before you mentioned the alleged lies.

No, you made a few days after my last mention of the untruths,
in a thread to which you were contributing, and what, six weeks,
after you last discussed the matter with me.

I don't see any reason to investigate your personal feud, at
least not at this time, particularly since the only reason you
bring it up is to take the spotlight off yourself, and your
con game magazine.

Regardless of your incorrect guesses about my motives, Mr.
Mckelvy, this is about a matter of logic, about sorting
facts from faith. You have been very quick to claim that you
are only intersted in facts, yet when I have showed you that
you claim about Mr. Krueger's lack of mendacity is not
supported by the evidence in the Google record, you can
neither support what you said, nor withdraw it. Instead,
you indulge yourself in name-calling.

All I am saying Mr. McKelvy, is that as shown by this exchange,
your position is based on faith alone. Which is ironic indeed,
given your pronouncements. :-)

why you can't hire people who won't get into screaming matches
in public, like Fremer did with Nousaine?

I am not aware of this happening, Mr. McKelvy. More faith-based
projection on your part, I suggest.

Fremer does work for you right? Did you ask him? Nousaine reported
it in the Audio Critic.

Can you give a reference, please.

No response from Mr. McKelvy. Why is is so hard for you believers
in "Scientism" ever to substantiate what you say, Mr. McKelvy? This
is a reasonable request, I thought: you made a claim about the
behavior of one of my writers; I would like to be able to read for
myself what Tom Nousaine wrote. Why are you afraid of me doing so?

snip of more namecalling

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

[snip]

Oops! Mikey lies again! Try "LieAlot Lozenges". They taste like ****,
and
they stick in your throat when you try to tell a Big One.

How many do you usually take in a day?

None, Mikey. Try a little truth serum on your pancakes. You'll be shocked
to
hear what you say.

I'm pretty sure I'd still think your an ass either way.

"paul packer" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 18:12:51 GMT, "
wrote:


Many pieces of audio gear sound the same.

Is that really true? I mean, if dogs can detect smells we have no hope
of detecting, maybe there are sound quality differences some of us are
not equipped to detect, and some of us are.

There exists measurement gear that can "hear" things way beyond our ear's
capability.

Maybe all audio gear
sounds different, but only some can detect it.

If that were true wouldn't someone have been able to tell in a DBT?

In which case the
argument will go on ad infinitum, and Arnie's infernal box will never
settle it.

I's already settled for most people who work in any audio field, outside
hi-fi.
Cel phones and hearing aids being just 2 examples.

What Arnie needs to invent is a large bionic ear with
supersonic hearing, which upon detecting distortion or colouration
beyond a certain point, will immediately fire a large calibre bullet
into the casing of the unit in question, and a smaller calibre bullet
into the head of the designer. That would certainly mean an
exponential improvement in hi-fi generally over a short period.

I think it would probably only take out the drug store stereo stuff asnd the
boom boxes, plus every SET on earth, oh yeah, and all the turntables.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Robert Morein" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"arny krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" blatantly lied
in message ...

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of
second-rate parts, cheapo sound card and undersized
relays, people were talking about differences they
hear.

Fact of the matter is that I assembled my first ABX
box in the middle 1970s
when there were no sound cards - and not really any
PCs, either.

The relays were far from being undersized -they were
if anything oversized.

The parts were mostly mil-spec. For example all of the
relays ran off of 28
volts DC, because that was the military standard at
the time.

And that doesn't make all that has gone before false.
It's as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a
mixture. What people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true,
false, and imagination. But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that
isn't a simple "fact."

Muddled thinking, anybody?

Realistic, not simplistic.

It's quite amazing how being caught in three lies in
quick succession doesn't phase you, Robert. How do you
sear your conscience so thoroughly?

Mikey, pay attention. This is an example of what we're
trying to get you out of.

So Morein, what's wrong with publishing a public correction
of three of your more recent lies?

Mikey, this is how you learned to post. There are better human beings to
copy.

If irony killed.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
k.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"George Middius" wrote in message
...

[snip]
I'm open to discussing anything for which there is evidence. Merely
speculating that there might be something we don't know about
listening
is
nothing but mental masturbation, and a pointless excercise.

The pro ABX side presents evidence, teh anti-ABX side presents
rhetoric,
most of it pointlessly nasty.

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of second-rate parts,
cheapo sound card and undersized relays, people were talking about
differences they hear.

And he was one of them. He put the abx box together to prove that
differences DO exist, you ****ing moron.

He is a mere pseudoscientist, a poseur, a fraud, and
a charlatan. And that doesn't make all that has gone before false. It's
as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a mixture. What
people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true, false, and imagination.
But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that isn't a simple
"fact."


You can't seem to get your head around the fact that things either sound
different or not. There are reliable ways to discover if there are
differences, and one of them is ABX.

You chose to "follow" Arny because you are a born follower. You never
had
an
original thought in your head. And unfortunately, you picked the wrong
person to follow.

A. I'm not following him, we simply agree on the validity of DBT's for
audio.
B. I have original thoughts all the time, just not about a hack like
you.
C. You don't know science any better than you know the law or the size
of
that telescope.

What is this thing about a telescope?

You don't remember? Think back to how you screwed up the math on the size
of (the Hubble I think) on another NG. RAT or RAP, not positive which, but
I think it was the former.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"ScottW" wrote in message
news:%ciLe.359$Ji.305@lakeread02...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

I'm sorry nothing can be done about your heredity.

Sounds rather bigoted to me.

ScottW

I'm sorry. Mikey is "special."

The typical tactic from someone who already knows he's lost. Claim the
opponent is inferior or defective. Demean them and maybe it won't make
you
feel like such an idiot, even though you've demonstrated repeatedly that
you
are simply a sore loser.

I'm sorry, Mikey. There really are dumb people in the world, and you're
one
of them. There is a certain dullness about you, a slowness, a clumsiness
of
your mental machinery. You are just not very smart.

Smart enoujgh to know you had no chance in your lawsuit, even before I ever
heard about it.

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

[snip]

Oops! Mikey lies again! Try "LieAlot Lozenges". They taste like
****,
and
they stick in your throat when you try to tell a Big One.

How many do you usually take in a day?

None, Mikey. Try a little truth serum on your pancakes. You'll be
shocked
to
hear what you say.

I'm pretty sure I'd still think your an ass either way.

Mikey, "your" and "you're" have entirely different meanings.
"Your" is the possessive of "you." It indicates ownership.
"You're" is a contraction of "you are".
Your sentence would read correctly if you had written, " I'm pretty sure I'd
still think you're an ass either way."
But you are a near illiterate, and you really don't belong here.
We must use simple sentences to communicate with you, Mikey. You are not
smart. Smart people do not make the kind of grammatical mistakes that you
make. You are a dummy. I find it inconceivable that you could have an IQ of
131. You're just plain dumb.

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Robert Morein" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"arny krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" blatantly lied
in message ...

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of
second-rate parts, cheapo sound card and undersized
relays, people were talking about differences they
hear.

Fact of the matter is that I assembled my first ABX
box in the middle 1970s
when there were no sound cards - and not really any
PCs, either.

The relays were far from being undersized -they were
if anything oversized.

The parts were mostly mil-spec. For example all of the
relays ran off of 28
volts DC, because that was the military standard at
the time.

And that doesn't make all that has gone before false.
It's as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a
mixture. What people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true,
false, and imagination. But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that
isn't a simple "fact."

Muddled thinking, anybody?

Realistic, not simplistic.

It's quite amazing how being caught in three lies in
quick succession doesn't phase you, Robert. How do you
sear your conscience so thoroughly?

Mikey, pay attention. This is an example of what we're
trying to get you out of.

So Morein, what's wrong with publishing a public correction
of three of your more recent lies?

Mikey, this is how you learned to post. There are better human beings to
copy.

If irony killed.

Mikey, that's Arny's phrase. Only a slave copies his master.

" wrote in message
.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
k.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"George Middius" wrote in message
...

[snip]
I'm open to discussing anything for which there is evidence. Merely
speculating that there might be something we don't know about
listening
is
nothing but mental masturbation, and a pointless excercise.

The pro ABX side presents evidence, teh anti-ABX side presents
rhetoric,
most of it pointlessly nasty.

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of second-rate
parts,
cheapo sound card and undersized relays, people were talking about
differences they hear.

And he was one of them. He put the abx box together to prove that
differences DO exist, you ****ing moron.

He is a mere pseudoscientist, a poseur, a fraud, and
a charlatan. And that doesn't make all that has gone before false.
It's
as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a mixture. What
people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true, false, and
imagination.
But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept that isn't a simple
"fact."


You can't seem to get your head around the fact that things either
sound
different or not. There are reliable ways to discover if there are
differences, and one of them is ABX.

You chose to "follow" Arny because you are a born follower. You never
had
an
original thought in your head. And unfortunately, you picked the
wrong
person to follow.

A. I'm not following him, we simply agree on the validity of DBT's for
audio.
B. I have original thoughts all the time, just not about a hack like
you.
C. You don't know science any better than you know the law or the size
of
that telescope.

What is this thing about a telescope?

You don't remember? Think back to how you screwed up the math on the size
of (the Hubble I think) on another NG. RAT or RAP, not positive which,
but
I think it was the former.

Mikey, you're imagining things. Your memory is very bad. If you were a smart
person, you would be able to use Google to find the relevant posts. But you
have a dull mind, an average IQ, and can only perform simple tasks.

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"ScottW" wrote in message
news:%ciLe.359$Ji.305@lakeread02...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

I'm sorry nothing can be done about your heredity.

Sounds rather bigoted to me.

ScottW

I'm sorry. Mikey is "special."

The typical tactic from someone who already knows he's lost. Claim the
opponent is inferior or defective. Demean them and maybe it won't make
you
feel like such an idiot, even though you've demonstrated repeatedly
that
you
are simply a sore loser.

I'm sorry, Mikey. There really are dumb people in the world, and you're
one
of them. There is a certain dullness about you, a slowness, a clumsiness
of
your mental machinery. You are just not very smart.

Smart enoujgh to know you had no chance in your lawsuit, even before I
ever
heard about it.

You are not amusing, Mikey. That is another sign of a person with a dull
mind. It's not even a very good insult.
Mikey, you are a dull knife, as your wit is dull.

"paul packer" wrote in message

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 18:12:51 GMT, "
wrote:


Many pieces of audio gear sound the same.

Is that really true? I mean, if dogs can detect smells we
have no hope of detecting, maybe there are sound quality
differences some of us are not equipped to detect, and
some of us are.

Humans have mass spectrometers, dogs don't.

Maybe all audio gear sounds different,
but only some can detect it.

If that's true why does this purported ability disappear
when the tests are not done with sight as a crutch?

In which case the argument
will go on ad infinitum, and Arnie's infernal box will
never settle it.

What infernal box? Blind tests can and have been done with
no switchboxes at all.

What Arnie needs to invent is a large
bionic ear with supersonic hearing, which upon detecting
distortion or colouration beyond a certain point, will
immediately fire a large calibre bullet into the casing
of the unit in question, and a smaller calibre bullet
into the head of the designer. That would certainly mean
an exponential improvement in hi-fi generally over a
short period.

Silly & childish.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Robert Morein" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"arny krueger" wrote in message
...

"Robert Morein" blatantly lied
in message
...

Mikey, before Arny Krueger assembled his box out of
second-rate parts, cheapo sound card and undersized
relays, people were talking about differences they
hear.

Fact of the matter is that I assembled my first ABX
box in the middle 1970s
when there were no sound cards - and not really any
PCs, either.

The relays were far from being undersized -they were
if anything oversized.

The parts were mostly mil-spec. For example all of
the relays ran off of 28
volts DC, because that was the military standard at
the time.

And that doesn't make all that has gone before
false. It's as
true as it ever was, which means, as always, it's a
mixture. What people
think and say about audio is a mixture of true,
false, and imagination. But
you can't seem to get your head around a concept
that isn't a simple "fact."

Muddled thinking, anybody?

Realistic, not simplistic.

It's quite amazing how being caught in three lies in
quick succession doesn't phase you, Robert. How do you
sear your conscience so thoroughly?

Mikey, pay attention. This is an example of what we're
trying to get you out of.

So Morein, what's wrong with publishing a public
correction of three of your more recent lies?

Mikey, this is how you learned to post. There are better
human beings to copy.

So Morien, are you saying that Mike should be a shameless
liar like you are?

"Robert Morein" wrote in message


But you have a dull
mind, an average IQ, and can only perform simple tasks.

If irony killed.

****-for-Brains tries to fight Mikey's battle for him.

But you have a dull
mind, an average IQ, and can only perform simple tasks.

If irony killed.

Arnii, you should just be glad Dr. Kroomacher engineered you to survive on
feces. If you had to buy people food like we do, you'd have gone broke
ages ago.

Arnii, you have become so totally ****ed up that you're mixing your
religious prattle with your political rhetoric and gooping it up with your
Kroologic and antihumanism.

when the tests are not done with sight as a crutch?

This is so ****ed up on so many levels that even I can't put a label to
it. What kind of ****ed-up individual believes listening to a stereo with
intact eyeballs is a "crutch"?

You may have turned the final corner, Turdy. Please gather your remaining
family members around you and ask them for comfort in your hour of need.