Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

Thank you friends,

Wessel

It's a matter of linearity, too. The 6SN7 has almost perfect curves.
Moreover, I prefer octals 'cause I'm very bad at welding and these larger
sockets are definitely a "plus" for me...

Ciao

Fabio



"Wessel Dirksen" ha scritto nel messaggio
oups.com...
Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

Thank you friends,

Wessel

Wessel Dirksen wrote:

Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

ECC82 isa 12AU7.

The gain is only 3dB less than 6SN7 for most apps.

Miller C is therefore only marginally lower then 6SN7.

The 6SN7 is more linear, but both tubes are
very useful, and I use either when it suits me.

The 12AU7 is a 9pin mini, which makes it less bulky...


On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

What you hear is what you get from the tubes you purchase,
and the way you use them in a circuit, and this will have as big an effect
as the tube.

Just try things and listen.

Patrick Turner.



Thank you friends,

Wessel

"Wessel Dirksen" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

Eric Barbour of Svetlana told me that the 6CG7 is the nine-pin
equivalent of the 6SN7. These are plentiful, inexpensive and sound
very good. There is also a version with an 8v filament,
8CG7 even cheaper. I found Westinghouse to perform well.

Iain

Patrick Turner wrote:

Wessel Dirksen wrote:

Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

ECC82 isa 12AU7.

The gain is only 3dB less than 6SN7 for most apps.

I get 1.4 db less. JLS

Miller C is therefore only marginally lower then 6SN7.

The 6SN7 is more linear, but both tubes are
very useful, and I use either when it suits me.

The 12AU7 is a 9pin mini, which makes it less bulky...

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

What you hear is what you get from the tubes you purchase,
and the way you use them in a circuit, and this will have as big an effect
as the tube.

Just try things and listen.

Patrick Turner.



Thank you friends,

Wessel

In article , Patrick Turner
wrote:

Wessel Dirksen wrote:

Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

ECC82 isa 12AU7.

The gain is only 3dB less than 6SN7 for most apps.

Miller C is therefore only marginally lower then 6SN7.

The 6SN7 is more linear, but both tubes are
very useful, and I use either when it suits me.

The 12AU7 is a 9pin mini, which makes it less bulky...


On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

What you hear is what you get from the tubes you purchase,
and the way you use them in a circuit, and this will have as big an effect
as the tube.

Just try things and listen.

But the human ear is a very imperfect measuring instrument, so results may
be inconsistent.


Regards,

John Byrns


Surf my web pages at, http://users.rcn.com/jbyrns/

Hi wessel ,

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's.

I don't know on wich plannet you've listened to tubes , but here on
earth I find the ECC82 dull , boring and slow . I don't even consider
them in my projects !!
If you can get tubes + sockets try an ECC40 ..... A little more gain
but bucketloads more music .
Ok , it's a matter of taste , but I can hardly immagine someone can
prefer an ECC82 / 12AU7 ......
C-Miller isn't the only thing that counts .

Ronald .

Fabio Berutti wrote:

It's a matter of linearity, too. The 6SN7 has almost perfect curves.
Moreover, I prefer octals 'cause I'm very bad at welding and these larger
sockets are definitely a "plus" for me...

Well actually, the use of high impedance loads on either of the
Ecc82 or 6SN7 will make them as linear as they can be, and
if you have Ia = 5 mA and RL = over 100k, then for preamp use
the distortion is so low at a volt that nobody need worry
if it can be measured, and in either case, its justa bitta 2H.
The high RL means that the DC should be brought to the anode via a
CCS, so Ia and Ea can be set for any value one wants
depending on the chosen value of Rk for biasing.

The lowest thd is where RL is a pure CCS.


The octal socket preamp tubes tend to have more hum though.

Patrick Turner.




Ciao

Fabio

"Wessel Dirksen" ha scritto nel messaggio
oups.com...
Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

Thank you friends,

Wessel

If you can get tubes + sockets try an ECC40 ..... A little more gain
but bucketloads more music

Or its 9 pin cousin the E80CC - sounds consideerably better than any
ECC82 I heard. If you want some expanation of why 6SN7s sound better
have a look at the distortion tests on this site.
http://users.rcn.com/joepage/tubelist.htm

Iain M Churches wrote:

"Wessel Dirksen" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

Eric Barbour of Svetlana told me that the 6CG7 is the nine-pin
equivalent of the 6SN7. These are plentiful, inexpensive and sound
very good. There is also a version with an 8v filament,
8CG7 even cheaper. I found Westinghouse to perform well.

Yup, versions of CG7 work identically to SN7. 6FQ7 is another version.
Telefunkens are the best imho, and they have a smaller plate structure.
When they decided to make the 6SN7 smaller for TV and other demands
such as telephone repeater amps,
they just stuffed the two halves if 6SN7 into the smaller bottle, and placed
a screen between
the two anodes on many but not all samples.
Later the smaller plate verions arrived. Power ratings for CG7 are lower
than SN7,
but still these tubes are OK to use anywhere, since nobody in their right
mind
would use tubes set up on the full plate dissipation ratings.

But if you want real grunt with a low µ tube, try 6H30, same pin out
as 6CG7, 6DJ8, etc, but it has similar µ to 12AU7, a little less thd, but
much lower Ra, since gm is higher.

Conrad Johnson use them in their amps.
Its a very nice russian triode.

Patrick Turner.





Iain

John Stewart wrote:

Patrick Turner wrote:

Wessel Dirksen wrote:

Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

ECC82 isa 12AU7.

The gain is only 3dB less than 6SN7 for most apps.

I get 1.4 db less. JLS

Let's not argue over a fraction of a dB, but SN7 µ = 20, and AU7 = 17.
The difference in the µ is 1.4 dB.
I'd generally use AU7 in a preamp with less Ia than SN7, so gain would be less
than the µ indicate if loaded with a high values of RL.
I'll use a 12AU7 to deliberately minimise gain, and with an unbypassed Rk,
and AU7 is an ideal line stage preamp tube.

Patrick Turner.





Miller C is therefore only marginally lower then 6SN7.

The 6SN7 is more linear, but both tubes are
very useful, and I use either when it suits me.

The 12AU7 is a 9pin mini, which makes it less bulky...

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

What you hear is what you get from the tubes you purchase,
and the way you use them in a circuit, and this will have as big an effect
as the tube.

Just try things and listen.

Patrick Turner.



Thank you friends,

Wessel

Ronald wrote:

Hi wessel ,

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's.

I don't know on wich plannet you've listened to tubes , but here on
earth I find the ECC82 dull , boring and slow . I don't even consider
them in my projects !!
If you can get tubes + sockets try an ECC40 ..... A little more gain
but bucketloads more music .
Ok , it's a matter of taste , but I can hardly immagine someone can
prefer an ECC82 / 12AU7 ......
C-Miller isn't the only thing that counts .

Ronald .

6H30 with similar gain to 12AU7 also could be said to have
more better buckets of Mozart.

But I have never had trouble wowing the audio aficionardos with 12AU7.

AU7 is said to be warmer than some other tubes, but it depends how you
use it.

Patrick Turner.

Andy Evans wrote:

If you can get tubes + sockets try an ECC40 ..... A little more gain
but bucketloads more music

Or its 9 pin cousin the E80CC - sounds consideerably better than any
ECC82 I heard. If you want some expanation of why 6SN7s sound better
have a look at the distortion tests on this site.
http://users.rcn.com/joepage/tubelist.htm

The above url does not appear to contain the signal voltages
at which the thd measurements were taken.

The loading was often a "65H" choke, but was the L measured at
50Hz, or 1 kHz? Exactly what was the load Z?

65H at 1 khz would be 408 kohms, a load about equal to using a CCS load.

But if 65H is the 50Hz value, the L at 1 kHz may only be 6.5H,
so RL would then only be 40.8 kohms.


Some tubes measure 0.4% thd, and a some only 0.04%.

With a very high RL value with RL 20Ra, thd with 6SN7 can be only
0.1% at 10vrms of output, so that at 1vrms output, thd would be 0.01%.
This is a typical measurement of a preamp using high value RL.

The above list of measurements by the guy at the above url has been
prepared
using a test signal with 0.03% thd, rather too high to get any idea
of the low level performance of a triode circuit.

Steve Bench might have more usable info on triode distortions.

Patrick Turner.

Wessel:

The octal drivers are the real thing, the novals the cheap 50s
equivalent, made tolerable only by oodles of NFB, the NFB being the
significant element, and very undesirable too. As it happens, I am a
beeeg fan of the 6SN7 but, unlike Eric Barbour (who on everything else
is ultra-reliable), I also like the 12AU7. However, they are different
horses for different courses according to *taste* rather than mere
measurements. Some of those little tubes are truly trash, the very
popular 12AX7 for one -- just try to implement it without so much NFB
that your sound will totally homogenized. Among those little tubes the
6CG7 is almost an exact 6SN7 equivalent (and some early ones are very
nearly exact), and 12AT7, with different parameters though, comes very
near the precise sound of the 6SN7 at higher gain.

There's something overlooked in the general discussion in this thread,
viz that, because your driver is so much in charge of the tonal colour
of the output on the far side of the power tube and transformer, it is
essential to put a lot of current on the driver to linearize it and
deal with the Miller capacitance between the driver and the power tube.
That alone rules a lot of these little power tubes out of use in
anything but guitar amps. When you look into the 6SL7, the high mu
sister of the 6SL7, you will discover it has two sets of curves, low
current for RIAA pre-amp use, high current for power tube use. Those
old guys knew a thing or two about amplifiers.

It is also much easier building a truly linear amp with 6SN7 than with
the little 9-pin jobs.

HTH.

Andre Jute

Wessel Dirksen wrote:
Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

Thank you friends,

Wessel

"Ronald" wrote in message
...
Hi wessel ,

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's.

I don't know on wich plannet you've listened to tubes , but here on
earth I find the ECC82 dull , boring and slow . I don't even consider
them in my projects !!
If you can get tubes + sockets try an ECC40 ..... A little more gain
but bucketloads more music .
Ok , it's a matter of taste , but I can hardly immagine someone can
prefer an ECC82 / 12AU7 ......
C-Miller isn't the only thing that counts .

Ronald .


I'm sure that makes some designers real uneasy... Like McIntosh folk, for
instance... Of all the goofy **** to say. This place's turned to ****.
Why not design & build some gear, instead of discussing x vs. y?
-dim
"Show me the product, Motherf8cker!"
-Eric the drummer.

" wrote:

Wessel:

The octal drivers are the real thing, the novals the cheap 50s
equivalent, made tolerable only by oodles of NFB, the NFB being the
significant element, and very undesirable too. As it happens, I am a
beeeg fan of the 6SN7 but, unlike Eric Barbour (who on everything else
is ultra-reliable), I also like the 12AU7. However, they are different
horses for different courses according to *taste* rather than mere
measurements. Some of those little tubes are truly trash, the very
popular 12AX7 for one -- just try to implement it without so much NFB
that your sound will totally homogenized. Among those little tubes the
6CG7 is almost an exact 6SN7 equivalent (and some early ones are very
nearly exact), and 12AT7, with different parameters though, comes very
near the precise sound of the 6SN7 at higher gain.

There's something overlooked in the general discussion in this thread,
viz that, because your driver is so much in charge of the tonal colour
of the output on the far side of the power tube and transformer, it is
essential to put a lot of current on the driver to linearize it and
deal with the Miller capacitance between the driver and the power tube.
That alone rules a lot of these little power tubes out of use in
anything but guitar amps. When you look into the 6SL7, the high mu
sister of the 6SL7, you will discover it has two sets of curves, low
current for RIAA pre-amp use, high current for power tube use. Those
old guys knew a thing or two about amplifiers.

It is also much easier building a truly linear amp with 6SN7 than with
the little 9-pin jobs.

I'll have to catch up with what Eric Barbour has writ...

I'd agree with you about 12AX7 and some other nine pin minnies.

I would also say than mild applications of current FB in unbypassed Rk
and simple shunt FB loops with low µ triodes to control line stage gain
does little to the sonics that is detrimental imho.

But I would never build a preamp like way ARC does it, for a phono
stage in an SP11 they have 3 triodes, 3 mosfets, several j-fets,
several loops of FB in the 4 stages, and RIAA eq done with a shirtload of
global NFB around the 4 stages.


But the 6CG7 I have found around have **exactly** the same electrodes as I
have seen
inside 6SN7, and the thd of many samples of either SN7 or CG7 are in fact
identical.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, Telfunken made 6CG7 with smaller plate and
grid structures,
but the tube is electronically the same as a "big plate" 6CG7 or 6SN7, except
that the power
rating is lower.
I have also seen small anode versions of 12AU7, 12AT7, 12AX7, with
very small electrodes. I am not sure if the smaller versions sound worse.

But in a sound test with 4 different 6CG7 types used a preamp
with the volume control before the amp stage and CF buffer,
with a group of 4 of us gathered for the tube rolling, we unanimously thought

the Telefunken had the best sound, then came Aust made Miniwatt,
then Mullard, and deservedly last came the EH6CG7.

I measured the thd which was less than 0.015% at a volt of output,
and we only would have used 0.2v max, since it only takes 0.7v to drive the
power amps to clipping and levels we would never use.

So arguments about thd cannot be used to justify sonic differences imho,
because thd of the tubes in the preamps is below audibility, because it is
mainly 2H; RDH4 suggest that critical listeners with wide bw gear
would battle to detect 0.5% thd, which is 50 times greater than levels we are

talking about.

Meanwhile, a pair of 6CG7 in an LTP can easily make 100 vrms output at each
anode at
1% thd, mainly 3H, since the 2H all gets cancelled, or converted to 3H.
At 1vrms output, an LTP in a balanced preamp might only make 0.01% or less at
1v......
Surely this is linear enough for all concerned with fidelity?

My latest preamp uses bootstrapped follower stages which are like
µ-followers,
and I use a variety of 6EJ7 in triode, 12AT7, 12AU7, and the sound is
OK to all who hear any music through it.
( I even used it yesterday with a client's tiny 100 watt digital monobloc
power
amps from CIAUDIO and the sound wasn't too bad....boy, these new digital amps
are gonna make
all preceeding class AB transistor amps obsolete real quick, if you ask me,
but
they won't shift tubes off the planet ).


The God Of Triodes is a benign god, and dishes out the goodness factor
with various tubes that are made, and He's better at doing that on some days
than others,
when it seems He forgets an occasional batch.
Not all tubes that are made have been Annointed.


I don't argue with a God, and One in charge of so much High Voltage.

In the immortal words of a long departed old guru who tried many boxes full
of tubes,
one has to " plug in a tube and listen ".


Patrick Turner.





HTH.

Andre Jute

Wessel Dirksen wrote:
Hi RAT's,

I'm curious about the comparison of these two tubes. They are somewhat
similar in gain, tranductance, etc. Yet the ECC82 has a substantially
lower Miller cap value which would seem to have some sonic advantages.
Yet the 6SN7 seems to get the praise everywhere.

On this note, I'm developing a personal "style" in this stuff as I like
the lower mu fast and transient sound from the ECC82's I have as
compared to 12AX7's and ECC81's. I have not tried any other types. Are
there other fast and sweet sounding types out there in this general
category that I should know about that aren't only available as NOS?

Thank you friends,

Wessel

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...


Iain M Churches wrote:

Eric Barbour of Svetlana told me that the 6CG7 is the nine-pin
equivalent of the 6SN7. These are plentiful, inexpensive and sound
very good. There is also a version with an 8v filament,
8CG7 even cheaper. I found Westinghouse to perform well.

Yup, versions of CG7 work identically to SN7. 6FQ7 is another version.
Telefunkens are the best imho, and they have a smaller plate structure.
When they decided to make the 6SN7 smaller for TV and other demands
such as telephone repeater amps,
they just stuffed the two halves if 6SN7 into the smaller bottle, and
placed
a screen between
the two anodes on many but not all samples.
Later the smaller plate verions arrived. Power ratings for CG7 are lower
than SN7,
but still these tubes are OK to use anywhere, since nobody in their right
mind
would use tubes set up on the full plate dissipation ratings.

But if you want real grunt with a low µ tube, try 6H30, same pin out
as 6CG7, 6DJ8, etc, but it has similar µ to 12AU7, a little less thd, but
much lower Ra, since gm is higher.

Conrad Johnson use them in their amps.
Its a very nice russian triode.

Thanks. I will keep an eye open for 6H30

Iain

Hi Guys,

This is a single reply to you as a group, for this kind of discussion
is what I was hoping to find here. Thanks for the personal taste info
as well as the tech stuff. Both are very important. Since I have only
tried 3 different line stage tubes with various configurations, I
really need this exchange of experience. In any rate I will be getting
some of the tubes you guys have brought in here.

The US National 12AU7's I have, have a fast transient sound which I
tend to prefer as a general trend because I'm an imaging freak. But
admittedly when I used the 2 Mullard 12AT7's I have in a somewhat
similar setup (similar Ra*3 GC, obviously with higher gain) there was a
very subtle lifelike musical quality to them but at expense of
transient behavior where the 12AU7's seemed to image better. (I checked
impedance matching etc, and keep Vswing symmetry similar)I don't really
care for the 12AX7 at all, and I have quite a few of these in different
flavors, but all are too loosey goosey for me even when pulling the
gain way back. So if Ronald's findings about the 12AU7 possibly apply
to me as well here, would I get the best of both worlds by sticking
with low mu (+/- 20) but by using a different tube such as one of those
recommended here? Or is the explanation for my findings above based
more on quality of Mullard vs. National, than type of tube. (some
electroharmonics 12AU7's are on the way so maybe I'll hear a difference
there)

Andre's comment over the bases brings up another issue that has been on
my mind. Even if the parameters are the same, does "equivalant" really
exist or will there always be somewhat definable characteristic
differences based on the size of the bottle, and/or structures inside?

Patrick, you've described a rather broad use of different but similar
tube types. Have you noticed any particularly outstanding results with
any specific tube in this class in a given function?

BTW, about transience. I think in mechanical terms, so I tend to look
at it from a lever standpoint. A higher mu tube can be likend to a
longer more powerful (and slower) lever, but how does "choking up" on a
larger lever compare to a shorter lever? I guess I'm curious what can
be said about comparing musical performance between 2 (hypothetical)
scenarios (assuming both with symmetric V swings run well under max
limits and +/- similar gain):

1) A low mu tube in Grd Cath run at say Ra=6*Rp
2) A medium mu tube in similar Grd Cath at say Ra=2*Rp

Wessel

Ok, you guys have convinced me that better sounding horizons are on the
way than 12AU7's. I just bit the bullet and ordered some Sovtec 6SN7's
with octal sockets which I can get readily here in The
Netherlands/Belgium. The 6CG7's, which would not require a change of
socket, turned out to not be easily available here.

Does anybody know of a good internet order supplier for tubes in the
EC? Getting stuff from the States is not a good idea.

Which once again strokes my cerebrum. Why the heck did I move here to
begin with?

Wessel

Wessel Dirksen wrote:
Ok, you guys have convinced me that better sounding horizons are on the
way than 12AU7's. I just bit the bullet and ordered some Sovtec 6SN7's
with octal sockets which I can get readily here in The
Netherlands/Belgium. The 6CG7's, which would not require a change of
socket, turned out to not be easily available here.

Does anybody know of a good internet order supplier for tubes in the
EC? Getting stuff from the States is not a good idea.

Which once again strokes my cerebrum. Why the heck did I move here to
begin with?

Wessel

http://www.die-wuestens.de/eindex.htm (tubes, sockets and other stuff)
http://www.btb-electronic.de/en/index.html

Special offers and Russian tubes:
http://www.pollin.de/shop/shop.php
http://www.oppermann.de/ (Also offers components for radio restauration)

Your second question seems to be rethorical ;-)

Kind regards, Eike
--
Lions go to absurd lengths to retain the posession of their skins.
- Stewart Edward White 1913

Eike Lantzsch, ZP6CGE schreef:
Wessel Dirksen wrote:
Ok, you guys have convinced me that better sounding horizons are on the
way than 12AU7's. I just bit the bullet and ordered some Sovtec 6SN7's
with octal sockets which I can get readily here in The
Netherlands/Belgium. The 6CG7's, which would not require a change of
socket, turned out to not be easily available here.

Does anybody know of a good internet order supplier for tubes in the
EC? Getting stuff from the States is not a good idea.

Which once again strokes my cerebrum. Why the heck did I move here to
begin with?

Wessel

http://www.die-wuestens.de/eindex.htm (tubes, sockets and other stuff)
http://www.btb-electronic.de/en/index.html

Special offers and Russian tubes:
http://www.pollin.de/shop/shop.php
http://www.oppermann.de/ (Also offers components for radio restauration)

Your second question seems to be rethorical ;-)

Kind regards, Eike
--
Lions go to absurd lengths to retain the posession of their skins.
- Stewart Edward White 1913

Thank you for the links Eike. Looks perfect, Paypal etc. As far as the
2nd rhetorical question goes, that says more about myself and maybe the
American in me than is does over Europe. BTW, I like your signature
quote from White. Its philosophical content does have something to do
that applies to my last existential question.

Wessel