[gjsmo]

Not to be overbearing (as a newb), but I'd love to hear feedback on my
first "real" mix. It's an instrumental right now, but it does have
vocals. It's also only the second take.

http://fileape.com/dl/1XNIf0PevJDKgok3 (FLAC)\

Overall, my only problems are audibility of the bass (it doesn't have
enough "pluck" for me), but that's the bass, and the quality of the
drums (my drums are horrible, and I need more mics). What do you pros
notice?

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

gjsmo wrote:

Not to be overbearing (as a newb), but I'd love to hear feedback on my
first "real" mix. It's an instrumental right now, but it does have
vocals. It's also only the second take.

http://fileape.com/dl/1XNIf0PevJDKgok3 (FLAC)\

Overall, my only problems are audibility of the bass (it doesn't have
enough "pluck" for me), but that's the bass, and the quality of the
drums (my drums are horrible, and I need more mics). What do you pros
notice?

Less of what is not too low in the mix, first of all less guitars. Forget
about DI's, mic'm up.

Cymbals sound healthy, you're doing something right.

Kind regards

Peter Larseb

[gjsmo]

On Apr 29, 12:56*pm, "Peter Larsen" wrote:
gjsmo wrote:
Not to be overbearing (as a newb), but I'd love to hear feedback on my
first "real" mix. It's an instrumental right now, but it does have
vocals. It's also only the second take.
http://fileape.com/dl/1XNIf0PevJDKgok3(FLAC)\
Overall, my only problems are audibility of the bass (it doesn't have
enough "pluck" for me), but that's the bass, and the quality of the
drums (my drums are horrible, and I need more mics). What do you pros
notice?

Less of what is not too low in the mix, first of all less guitars. Forget
about DI's, mic'm up.

Cymbals sound healthy, you're doing something right.

* Kind regards

* Peter Larseb

Something right... that's good. Cymbals (actually, all of the drums
except the kick) are from one pencil condenser. I'm going to get a
dynamic mic on the snare and kick (there's a kick mic, but it's a
condenser WAY back - really just another room mic). Probably all
"vocal" mics, but I've had really good luck with a vocal on the snare,
pointed at the bottom.
DIs vs. mics - I have no good amps. We're a high school band - not
much money. Plugins sound good to me - we like the sound of them, and
the latency is great.
Less guitars... Even with the vocals on top? I suppose I'll have to
wait, since my vocalist is a bit unreliable.

Thanks for at least replying! Sometime (maybe in the next week), I
might have a second mix - probably another take, too.

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

gjsmo wrote:

Something right... that's good.

Yes, that is very good.

Go to the raw-tracks site, http://raw-tracks.com, there you will find
commented mixes and raw tracks, you can purchase a license to mix the tracks
but only ever publish the mix on the raw-tracks website. No affiliation.

Cymbals (actually, all of the drums except the kick) are from one pencil
condenser.

Some of the time when drum sound is not optimum you need to fix the kit
rather than the recording. A drumkit that is taped down for closemiking is a
very different object from a jazz kit that is tuned and configured to sound
well on its own, unamplified. A lot of people here know a lot more about
this than I do. If the kit is taped down and tuned for closemiking, then
that is what you should do and aim for a "concert sound".

I'm going to get a
dynamic mic on the snare and kick (there's a kick mic, but it's a
condenser WAY back - really just another room mic).

So there is none. Something dynamic omni strongly recommended, all mics are
omnis at 40 Hz anyway and all directional mics have a very strange frequency
response inside an open kickdrum, an omni is a lot simpler to deploy.

Probably all "vocal" mics,

That's a non-constructive way of thinking, when we are talking rock band
mics you have the generalists, the front mics for for solo vox and the
specialists - usually the kick mic and the overhead mics, have spares of
those for acoustic guitars and other strange sonic objects that are meant to
sound like the do. The generalists go on instrument loudspeakers, background
vox, toms, snare. The solo vox mic(s) are "luxury items" - ie. the
generalists may do fine for this - and go on the guy/girl who think he/she
can sing and the rest explains itself. SM57 is an example generalist, MD413
another, just to have one from each side of the pond. MD409 is an example
specialist, by being flat it is by design good for having in front of an
instrument amp.

but I've had really good luck with a vocal on the snare,
pointed at the bottom.

Fine, do it, don't worry, when it gets to show time or session time: do what
works, do it now, move on and get it done. Thinking is the homework to do
beforehand.

What you need first of all is a vision of the sonic image you want to end up
with. It is very much about layering and the tool to use is mic to sonic
object distance. This is why DI boxes are NO GOOD in a recording context
unless you want the sonic object in the front layer, with rythm guitar, bass
and keyboards you usually do not, a DI box comes with distance 0 and is all
direct sound an zero reflected sound. Do not forget the room, it is the
layer behind all the other layers.

DIs vs. mics - I have no good amps.

A lot of great musicians do not have good amps, doesn't matter, record what
they have. A DI will never sound as in the room, an amp will always.
Recording a band is about it all, not about the parts.

We're a high school band - not much money.

OK, you're in high school, basically you do it for fun (very important) and
for learning (quite important as a tool to have better fun later, including
making money while you have fun). So forget about the possibly crappy sound
of the guitar amp and record it well and put it properly in the perspective.
Here's why: if you can make a great recording of a crappy amp and a guitar
that is in different tune all over the fretboard, then you can also make a
great recording of a great amp and a great guitar. If you at the end of the
project, be it just a fun venture or a school project, only can make a
mediocre recording of a di-box output that doesn't work in the sonic
perspective you're trying to build what the craballulistan will you then do
if you encounter a great amp, guitar and player ... other than what you are
good at, making a mediocre recording. Much better to know how to make a
great recording then, right?

Plugins sound good to me - we like the sound of them, and
the latency is great.

The latency of a foot of air between mic and guitar amp loudspeaker is 1
millisecond.

Less guitars... Even with the vocals on top? I suppose I'll have to
wait, since my vocalist is a bit unreliable.

You have the guitars not on 10, not on 11, not on 12, not on 13, you have
them on frigging 14 on a scale from 1 to 10. So yes, less guitars. They are
a low crest factor sound source - google is your friend - and need not be
loud, a high crest factor sound source, such as drums, DOES naturally peak
above them if you have a balanced band sound and yes, vox goes on top too.
Didn't locate any in the sound sample provided, nice that it is full
wordlength and not clipped, thank you, you have a sane way of doing things.

Anyway, if you are to have vox on top of too loud guitars, then the balance
between vox and already too quiet drums and bass gets hopeless. A great
example of what balance is about: giving way so that all is audible. It is
actually also about getting the chords played by an ensemble right and
properly weighted because they have components from all instruments.

Thanks for at least replying! Sometime (maybe in the next week), I
might have a second mix - probably another take, too.

Sound engineering is more about turning down what is too loud than it is
about turning up that, which is not loud enough, applies also to equalizing.
It is a strong strategy to only use channel eq in turn down mode, also
reduces the use of channel and/or mix bus headroom.

Remember to record the room. At the end of the day you have success if the
recording sounds as if made with a single pair. See also what I wrote as
follow-up to Nate Najar.

Kind regards

Peter Larsen