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#1
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence
that he could. David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. |
#2
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 1:49*am, Bret L wrote:
*Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. *David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Everything Ferstler did in regards to DBTs and DIYs were done under the careful supervision of Roy Allison. Under scrutiny, it was revealed that Howard did the DBT incorrectly anyway. That's the reason why Howard was relegated to subwoofer and surround sound processor reviews in his later years...when you spend most of the review regurgitating the owner's manual, it's relatively hard to screw it up. |
#3
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 2:49*am, Bret L wrote:
*Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. *David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Well, blast, I cannot let this one pass, even though my better judgement says otherwise. Not too long ago I sold off the Dunlavy Cantatas in my smaller system (they were just too large for my wife's taste) and replaced them with some home-built jobs. I used Allison tweeters and Tang Band mids in vertical MTTM arrays with each system, and with a small Allison woofer on the bottom of the slender, four-foot-tall cabinets. I designed the crossover network myself (all second order, with polypropylene caps in the tweeter and midrange high-pass networks, bipolars elsewhere, chokes purchased from Parts Express, and with independent polyswitch fuses installed to protect each driver array). All of the woodworking and electrical assembly was done by me out in my workshop. After they were done, I compared them to the Cantatas (level matched, following guidelines I outlined in my recent AudioXpress article) and they sounded quite similar, with the new systems being a bit more spacious, thanks to the Allison tweeters and Tang Band mids and the nature of the Dunlavy directional output design. I then hauled them into my main system's listening room area and did a level-matched comparison between them and my Allison IC-20 models. During some of the A/B sequences, using mostly baroque and classical source materials (music most of you people would not be able to comprehend), I could hear no differences between my units and the Allison units at all. Prior to that, I built a custom center speaker for that main system to complement the IC-20s. A short tower model, it uses Allison mids and tweeters in a vertical MTTM array, with a single Allison 10-inch woofer at the bottom. It basically is one half of an IC-20 in a somewhat rectangular cabinet, but with the front panel sloped backwards four degrees to allow its shorter height (40 inches) to still keep the direct field focussed at seated ear height, and with a crossover network modified from two basic Allison designs to accommodate the different driver and cabinet layout. Like the other systems, this unit made use of polypropylene caps and 18 AWG wire chokes (the network is not quite fully second order, with the woofer high pass being first order), and also made use of separate polyswitch fuses for each driver array, and even the woofer. The system sounds identical to an IC-20. A few months back I refurbished all four of the Allison Model Four systems used as surround speakers in my main system. I did a documentation report on the project for the Classic Speaker pages, and even wrote an article on the work for an on-line woodworking chat group. The caps were replaced with polypropylene jobs, polyswitches were installed, and the tweeter high pass network was converted from first to second order to better protect the drivers from overload. Not too long ago, I refurbished the crossover networks in the 19-year- old IC-20 models, replacing all of the stock caps with polypropylene jobs, even the big one in the woofer network. The job required a major revamping of the network mount and lots of soldering work. The speakers had been working fine, but I wanted to make sure that cap deterioration would not take place in the near future. Three weeks ago I built two new surround speakers for my smaller system from scratch, thereby freeing up two Allison Model Four systems that had been handling that task. As usual, I used polypropylene caps, new 18 AWG chokes, and polyswitches. The Allison's are physically too large for that kind of duty, and after I replace their old stock caps with polypropylene jobs and install polyfuses to protect the tweeters I plan on putting them up for sale. So, guess what, I can design and build (and refurbish) speakers, and the ones I have built sound quite good. I have no intention of doing any kind of DIY articled about the work, simply because I am done with audio journalism, period. Howard Ferstler |
#4
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 11:56*am, Boon wrote:
On Jan 14, 1:49*am, Bret L wrote: *Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. *David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Everything Ferstler did in regards to DBTs and DIYs were done under the careful supervision of Roy Allison. Under scrutiny, it was revealed that Howard did the DBT incorrectly anyway. That's the reason why Howard was relegated to subwoofer and surround sound processor reviews in his later years...when you spend most of the review regurgitating the owner's manual, it's relatively hard to screw it up. I decided to take a look here on a whim, and instead of you guys just giving it a rest you decided to do a fast slandering job on me. Since there may be people here who are not up to date on how you guys operate, I have decided to interject the information below. Roy Allison never did "supervise" my DBT work. I have only met him three times in my life, and we never even lived close to each other. Sure, I wrote him regularly (and still do), but most of the time we just chatted about topics unrelated to audio, let alone about any of my reviewing projects. I will say that no audio writer or engineer worth a flip would do serious comparing work by any means other than the DBT protocol. The response-curve readout technique I used with speaker A/B comparing was developed by me independently from anybody else. First, a stereo pair of speakers are arranged AB/AB style in my main listening room (a 3400 cubic foot area that has the speakers 11 to 15 feet away, depending upon manufacturer suggestions, from the listening and measuring axis) to keep their soundstages the same width. The procedure itself consists of first level matching the speakers using an RTA to get their outputs to overlap as exactly as possible, using a broad-bandwidth, pink-noise source. Level matching with speakers, as with any other components being compared, is critical, and to do that I use an AudioControl SA3051 in its 20-second averaging mode do a cumulative readout as I slowly move the microphone over a 1 x 1 x 5 foot area near seated ear height at the listening couch as the broad-bandwidth pink-noise source is played. I have done it that way, in that room for many years, thereby giving me a consistant reference standard for loudspeaker performance, and the idea is to get a proper room curve that approximates a power response readout. David Moran, who uses a dbx RTA to the same kind of comparisons, but with somewhat different microphone movements, has indicated to at least one chat group that my results parallel his when the same speakers are involved. I use this technique to both set levels for A/B comparisons and to give me response curves to reproduce and discuss in my speaker reviews. Once the levels are properly set for the comparison work, I go on to do standard comparisons, using a variety of classical, romantic-era, and baroque sources. I even use rock and jazz at times, and with most of my speaker reviews I tell the reader just what recordings are involved, even going to far as to print the recording stock numbers. Anybody who has ever read any of my product reviews (that probably does not include you) will acknowledge that my reports (be they about speakers or be they about anything else) are anything but regurgitations of the owner's manuals. Sure, I note manufacturer specs and comments (any good reviewer should go over those in a review), but I then do a decent analysis of the performance of whatever component I am dealing with. When doing my DBT work with amps, wires, and players I either used a switcher and reference amp that allowed me to get the levels precisely matched before doing sighted comparisons, or else I used an ABX Comparator that Tom Nousaine loaned to me for several months. The device had an on-board digital volt meter and signal generator that allowed for very precise level matching, one channel at a time, and it also forced the participant to do the comparing blind. The results I got with the device were consistant with what I discovered during my sighted and level-matched comparisons. Using the ABX device finally convinced me that doing amp, wire, and player reviews was just not something I cared to fool with any more. There simply was not anything one could say about their sound, because they had no sound. I did stick with reviewing receivers and processors for a while, because those at least had surround technology that could be analyzed. The resutls with my ABX comparisons were that any good amp, provided it is not pushed hard against its clipping level, will sound the same as any other good amp. Good amps are common enough for most intelligent people to make purchases based upon price and maximum power needs. Other results were that any good lamp cord 16 AWG or larger, will sound as good as any exotic versions, unless the manufacturer of the exotic has managed to screw up their performance by installing shunt capacitors or some other inane modifications to make them sound different from (read, less accurate than) good-old wires. Ditto for interconnects. As for players, well, any good CD or DVD player will sound identical to just about any other, with the primary exceptions being exotic models that have been modified by their borderline corrupt manufacturers to sound different from (read, less accurate than) the norm. Finally, just in case you or anybody else here really does want to read some of my published reviews, go to: http://findarticles.com/p/search/?tb=art&qt="Howard%2C+Ferstler" The only problem with the reprints is that the program will not reproduce my measurement curves, but you should not care, anyway, because you could not tell an honest review from a dishonest one if your life depended upon it. PS: I have known David Rich for years (we have even done joint reviews together), and while he and I disagree about how speakers should perform (reverberant-field bias vs direct-field bias), we agree precisely when it comes to amps, wires, audio gimmicks, and players. Howard Ferstler |
#5
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
"The people who regularly hang out here need to get a life."
Howard Ferstler |
#6
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 4:05*pm, Ferstler wrote:
On Jan 14, 11:56*am, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 1:49*am, Bret L wrote: *Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. *David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Everything Ferstler did in regards to DBTs and DIYs were done under the careful supervision of Roy Allison. Under scrutiny, it was revealed that Howard did the DBT incorrectly anyway. That's the reason why Howard was relegated to subwoofer and surround sound processor reviews in his later years...when you spend most of the review regurgitating the owner's manual, it's relatively hard to screw it up. I decided to take a look here on a whim ....and the rest is tired bull**** that no one will bother reading. You know, Harold, just like your subwoofer reviews. |
#7
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 4:09*pm, "Trevor Wilson" wrote:
"The people who regularly hang out here need to get a life." Howard Ferstler These last few posts of Harold's are the most productive thing he's done since he filed his last book at the university library. |
#8
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 5:09*pm, "Trevor Wilson" wrote:
"The people who regularly hang out here need to get a life." Howard Ferstler Good point. Adios. Howard Ferstler |
#9
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 5:13*pm, Boon wrote:
On Jan 14, 4:05*pm, Ferstler wrote: On Jan 14, 11:56*am, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 1:49*am, Bret L wrote: *Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. *David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Everything Ferstler did in regards to DBTs and DIYs were done under the careful supervision of Roy Allison. Under scrutiny, it was revealed that Howard did the DBT incorrectly anyway. That's the reason why Howard was relegated to subwoofer and surround sound processor reviews in his later years...when you spend most of the review regurgitating the owner's manual, it's relatively hard to screw it up.. I decided to take a look here on a whim ...and the rest is tired bull**** that no one will bother reading. You know, Harold, just like your subwoofer reviews.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - This site is basically occupied by a group of dysfunctional goons. Enjoy your life, pinhead. Howard Ferstler |
#10
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 5:24*pm, Ferstler wrote:
On Jan 14, 5:13*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 4:05*pm, Ferstler wrote: On Jan 14, 11:56*am, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 1:49*am, Bret L wrote: *Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. *David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Everything Ferstler did in regards to DBTs and DIYs were done under the careful supervision of Roy Allison. Under scrutiny, it was revealed that Howard did the DBT incorrectly anyway. That's the reason why Howard was relegated to subwoofer and surround sound processor reviews in his later years...when you spend most of the review regurgitating the owner's manual, it's relatively hard to screw it up. I decided to take a look here on a whim ...and the rest is tired bull**** that no one will bother reading. You know, Harold, just like your subwoofer reviews.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - This site is basically occupied by a group of dysfunctional goons. Enjoy your life, pinhead. Why do you keep making these simple-minded exits? Have the creative juices dried up? Do you have nothing more to live for than the hope that someone on the Internet still remembers you? Do something with your life, Harold. As long as you draw breath, it's not too late. Stop lamenting the passing of your supposed hobby--audio as you think it should exist--and move on. These sporadic appearances of yours are the very definition of pathetic. |
#11
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 3:31 pm, Ferstler wrote:
On Jan 14, 2:49 am, Bret L wrote: Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Well, blast, I cannot let this one pass, even though my better judgement says otherwise. Not too long ago I sold off the Dunlavy Cantatas in my smaller system (they were just too large for my wife's taste) and replaced them with some home-built jobs. I used Allison tweeters and Tang Band mids in vertical MTTM arrays with each system, and with a small Allison woofer on the bottom of the slender, four-foot-tall cabinets. I designed the crossover network myself (all second order, with polypropylene caps in the tweeter and midrange high-pass networks, bipolars elsewhere, chokes purchased from Parts Express, and with independent polyswitch fuses installed to protect each driver array). All of the woodworking and electrical assembly was done by me out in my workshop. After they were done, I compared them to the Cantatas (level matched, following guidelines I outlined in my recent AudioXpress article) and they sounded quite similar, with the new systems being a bit more spacious, thanks to the Allison tweeters and Tang Band mids and the nature of the Dunlavy directional output design. I then hauled them into my main system's listening room area and did a level-matched comparison between them and my Allison IC-20 models. During some of the A/B sequences, using mostly baroque and classical source materials (music most of you people would not be able to comprehend), I could hear no differences between my units and the Allison units at all. Yes, but you can't buy Allison tweeters, anymore can you? And how efficient is this system? |
#12
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 10:20*pm, ScottW wrote:
On Jan 14, 2:14*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 4:09*pm, "Trevor Wilson" wrote: "The people who regularly hang out here need to get a life." Howard Ferstler These last few posts of Harold's are the most productive thing he's done since he filed his last book at the university library. and about 10x the audio content of your lifes work. You're just mad that I won't use old beat-up King Crimson and Genesis LPs to evaluate every piece of equipment like you do. An audio post on RAO and what does Phillips do in spite of his claimed desire for on-topic posting? He ****es all over it like an infant in need of potty training. You moron. The post was directed toward Harold's ability to do DIY. I kept on-topic. It's YOU who is trolling...right here, right now. Your obvious Ferstler envy in every post is almost nauseating. *Will you ever grow up? You have an obvious "envy" fixation. You imagine men are envying your life (sorry, but they aren't), envying your wife (she's good looking, but I've had better...which you've seen) and now supposedly I'm envying Howard (which makes absolutely no sense since Howard has retired to oblivion). You know, obsessing over envy like you do is indicative of a certain personality disorder as well. Care to hazard a guess before I drop another bomb on your pointed little head? |
#13
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 15, 12:08*am, Bret L wrote:
On Jan 14, 3:31 pm, Ferstler wrote: On Jan 14, 2:49 am, Bret L wrote: *Ferstler has never done any DIY projects. Nor is there any evidence that he could. *David Rich is another matter. In the old "Audio Critic" he would g through commercial designs and essentially critique their component engineering, always suggesting a better IC or other part for each stage. Why he didn't simply design one "de novo" and publish a PCB layout for us proles is my question, and one he never deigned to answer. Well, blast, I cannot let this one pass, even though my better judgement says otherwise. Not too long ago I sold off the Dunlavy Cantatas in my smaller system (they were just too large for my wife's taste) and replaced them with some home-built jobs. I used Allison tweeters and Tang Band mids in vertical MTTM arrays with each system, and with a small Allison woofer on the bottom of the slender, four-foot-tall cabinets. I designed the crossover network myself (all second order, with polypropylene caps in the tweeter and midrange high-pass networks, bipolars elsewhere, chokes purchased from Parts Express, and with independent polyswitch fuses installed to protect each driver array). All of the woodworking and electrical assembly was done by me out in my workshop. After they were done, I compared them to the Cantatas (level matched, following guidelines I outlined in my recent AudioXpress article) and they sounded quite similar, with the new systems being a bit more spacious, thanks to the Allison tweeters and Tang Band mids and the nature of the Dunlavy directional output design. I then hauled them into my main system's listening room area and did a level-matched comparison between them and my Allison IC-20 models. During some of the A/B sequences, using mostly baroque and classical source materials (music most of you people would not be able to comprehend), I could hear no differences between my units and the Allison units at all. *Yes, but you can't buy Allison tweeters, anymore can you? And how efficient is this system?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members. I have a stockpile of Allison drivers, but, yes, many old Allison fans continue to scramble for spare parts. Fortunately, the drivers seem to hold up very well, excepting the urethane foam woofer surrounds, which deteriorate in a typical manner. I have replaced a lot of those (several companies offer replacement kits), both on my own drivers and on those belonging to friends. Fortunately, spare parts to refurbish crossover networks are readily available, and, really, about the only things there that might poop out would be the capacitors.. The smaller, main-channel systems I built have an 88 dB sensitivity rating (2.83 volts applied, at a one-meter distance). That is about the same as the bulk of the Allison speaker lineup (this varies, with the company's 4-ohm models being 90 dB), as well as a lot of other brands. The center speaker I built for my main system has an 87 dB sensitivity rating, which is identical to that of the left and right main Allison IC-20 units in the same installation. Allison speakers have a reputation (like the old, classic AR line) of being power hungry. However, you can get more than enough output with a typical 100 wpc receiver. While I used to power all three front systems with 250 watts apiece, I now use a receiver with 130 for each, and get plenty of volume, even with movies. Of course, having an 18- inch Velodyne subwoofer on hand to handle the bottom end takes considerable pressure off of the satellite amps. Howard Ferstler |
#14
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
In article
, Ferstler wrote: I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members. You're new here, aren't you? Stephen |
#15
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 15, 2:36*pm, Ferstler wrote:
I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members. Um, Harold...Bret is a blatant white supremacist who has been spamming this NG for quite some time with his "nationalist" propaganda. If you think that's sane and honest, then you've sunk even lower than anyone imagined. On the other hand, he also tends to offer opinions of stereo gear (i.e. Harbeth, Koetsu) that he has never heard, and then lies about having heard them at nameless audio salons. That makes you two audio frauds quite the matched pair. |
#16
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 15, 4:49*pm, Boon wrote:
On Jan 15, 2:36*pm, Ferstler wrote: I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members. Um, Harold...Bret is a blatant white supremacist who has been spamming this NG for quite some time with his *"nationalist" propaganda. If you think that's sane and honest, then you've sunk even lower than anyone imagined. On the other hand, he also tends to offer opinions of stereo gear (i.e. Harbeth, Koetsu) that he has never heard, and then lies about having heard them at nameless audio salons. That makes you two audio frauds quite the matched pair. Well, I certainly have no use for white supremacists (being a rather extreme Obama supporter, myself, and a borderline socialist when it comes to topics like medical and energy issues), but since I have been away for some time and have not bothered to even read any of the posts here that do not relate either to audio or to me, since some here seem to be obsessed with trashing me, I am not aware of Bret's social or political views. Frankly, it seems rather odd to me that a usenet group configured rec.audio.opinion would tolerate a multitude of posts that are not related to audio. I might as well post something off topic, anyway, and will note that I am certainly not an anti- nationalist, myself, although I am painfully aware that the USA, relative to the rest of the world, is in decline, and will continue to decline. Well, given global warming, pollution, and overpopulation issues, the whole planet is in decline. I am glad I do not have to worry about my non-existent children or grandchildren. I generally base my opinions of audio gear upon what I have actually heard (especially components that I have auditioned in my own listening rooms), although if seriously competent people like Nousaine, Pierce, Toole, or Rich put for strong opinions about gear I have not heard I will usually take what they say seriously. I continue to lament the fact that so many of you here consider me a fraud, particularly because so many of you have opinions based upon hearsay and not actually upon having read my books and review and commentary articles. Say, that situation kind of parallels what you say about Bret and his non-experience with certain audio components. Interestingly, the rancor here has often reached such a level that arguments are based simply upon not liking somebody just because they are supposed to not be liked. A kne-jerk approach is the norm. Actual issues relating to audio (dbt analyses, speaker comparing, surround technologies, design concepts, speaker/room behavior, etc.) are forgotten and the whole thing boils down to basic animosities in a kind of Hatfields vs McCoys style that has almost nothing to do with audio. This situation is almost painful to acknowledge, and is one reason I am simply not going to be drawn back into the backbiting series of insult swapping dialogs this site is notorious for. Howard Ferstler |
#17
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
In article
, Ferstler wrote: but since I have been away for some time and have not bothered to even read any of the posts here that do not relate either to audio or to me, since some here seem to be obsessed with trashing me, I am not aware of Bret's social or political views. That's nuts. I just opened RAO in google groups and nine of ten topics listed were started by BL. Seven are completely off-topic and the two remaining are attack posts. I don't suppose you read RAO by google grouping your name? Stephen |
#18
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
In article
, Ferstler wrote: This situation is almost painful to acknowledge, and is one reason I am simply not going to be drawn back into the backbiting series of insult swapping dialogs this site is notorious for. Takes two to swap insults. Stephen |
#19
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 14, 10:20*pm, ScottW wrote:
On Jan 14, 2:14*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 4:09*pm, "Trevor Wilson" wrote: "The people who regularly hang out here need to get a life." Howard Ferstler These last few posts of Harold's are the most productive thing he's done since he filed his last book at the university library. and about 10x the audio content of your lifes work. An audio post on RAO and what does Phillips do in spite of his claimed desire for on-topic posting? He ****es all over it like an infant in need of potty training. Your obvious Ferstler envy in every post is almost nauseating. *Will you ever grow up? Did you have some audio content to add, 2pid? |
#20
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 15, 4:40*pm, Ferstler wrote:
On Jan 15, 4:49*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 15, 2:36*pm, Ferstler wrote: I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members.. Um, Harold...Bret is a blatant white supremacist who has been spamming this NG for quite some time with his *"nationalist" propaganda. If you think that's sane and honest, then you've sunk even lower than anyone imagined. On the other hand, he also tends to offer opinions of stereo gear (i.e. Harbeth, Koetsu) that he has never heard, and then lies about having heard them at nameless audio salons. That makes you two audio frauds quite the matched pair. Well, I certainly have no use for white supremacists (being a rather extreme Obama supporter, myself, and a borderline socialist when it comes to topics like medical and energy issues), but since I have been away for some time and have not bothered to even read any of the posts here that do not relate either to audio or to me, since some here seem to be obsessed with trashing me, I am not aware of Bret's social or political views. Frankly, it seems rather odd to me that a usenet group configured rec.audio.opinion would tolerate a multitude of posts that are not related to audio. I might as well post something off topic, anyway, and will note that I am certainly not an anti- nationalist, myself, although I am painfully aware that the USA, relative to the rest of the world, is in decline, and will continue to decline. Well, given global warming, pollution, and overpopulation issues, the whole planet is in decline. I am glad I do not have to worry about my non-existent children or grandchildren. I generally base my opinions of audio gear upon what I have actually heard (especially components that I have auditioned in my own listening rooms), although if seriously competent people like Nousaine, Pierce, Toole, or Rich put for strong opinions about gear I have not heard I will usually take what they say seriously. I continue to lament the fact that so many of you here consider me a fraud, particularly because so many of you have opinions based upon hearsay and not actually upon having read my books and review and commentary articles. Say, that situation kind of parallels what you say about Bret and his non-experience with certain audio components. Interestingly, the rancor here has often reached such a level that arguments are based simply upon not liking somebody just because they are supposed to not be liked. A kne-jerk approach is the norm. Actual issues relating to audio (dbt analyses, speaker comparing, surround technologies, design concepts, speaker/room behavior, etc.) are forgotten and the whole thing boils down to basic animosities in a kind of Hatfields vs McCoys style that has almost nothing to do with audio. This situation is almost painful to acknowledge, and is one reason I am simply not going to be drawn back into the backbiting series of insult swapping dialogs this site is notorious for. And yet you remain, making daily declarations that you're leaving, never to return. How sad. |
#21
Posted to rec.audio.opinion
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 9:16*am, ScottW wrote:
On Jan 15, 7:39*am, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 10:20*pm, ScottW wrote: On Jan 14, 2:14*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 14, 4:09*pm, "Trevor Wilson" wrote: "The people who regularly hang out here need to get a life." Howard Ferstler These last few posts of Harold's are the most productive thing he's done since he filed his last book at the university library. and about 10x the audio content of your lifes work. You're just mad that I won't use old beat-up King Crimson and Genesis LPs to evaluate every piece of equipment like you do. Actually I'd use the Classic Genesis reissues or the Crimson anniversary CDs if I chose either. What I took to the shop was a CD by After Crying which I'm sure you have no knowledge of as they are far removed from the bubblegum bands you prefer. Bubblegum bands? My God, you're ignorant about music, and you're ignorant about the music I like. I look at one LP at Amoeba and suddenly I "prefer" it over other types of music? Is that all you have, you imbecile? I've seen your entire record collection, however. I know that you basically like old lumbering '70s prog rock, which is typical of a 50ish guy who still thinks wearing a mullet makes him cool. You have very narrow tastes in music, which makes you a deadly bore when it comes to music discussions. BTW, it was at your place where we listened to Genesis SEbtP where your anemic bassless speakers left Firth of Fith woefully unfullfilled. My anemic bassless speakers? Or the anemic baseless speakers I happened to be reviewing at the time? There is a difference. By the way, I've never heard substantial, accurate bass in your house. So how would you know? I also remember when you heard the DeVores, you were very smitten. Were you lying? An audio post on RAO and what does Phillips do in spite of his claimed desire for on-topic posting? He ****es all over it like an infant in need of potty training. You moron. The post was directed toward Harold's ability to do DIY. I kept on-topic. It's YOU who is trolling...right here, right now. Your obvious Ferstler envy in every post is almost nauseating. *Will you ever grow up? You have an obvious "envy" fixation. You imagine men are envying your life (sorry, but they aren't), envying your wife (she's good looking, but I've had better... LoL... Even as a sexist pig who thinks he can judge the quality of a woman by her looks you only manage to reveal what a shallow little man of no experience you are. Well, originally I was just being polite to you by saying your wife was hot. But you're so uber-sensitive that it's obvious you're the jealous husband type who has to buy her a Mercedes to keep her from straying. As long as she's such a sensitive topic, we'll know your marriage is on the rocks. It's not that your wife is so hot, she's just too hot for you. Or maybe she just married you during the couple of weeks when mullets were in vogue. I'm sure the women of your life agree with you on one point though....they were had. Why don't you ask them? I'm sure you'd be surprised at the answer. Not one of the women in my life think I'm a sexist pig. In fact, the only people who have ever called me misogynistic or sexist were dweeby virgins with mullets who still live in their parents' basement, or guys like you who were able to trick one woman into marrying them and keep paying on a daily basis to maintain the status quo. |
#22
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 15, 5:40*pm, Ferstler wrote:
On Jan 15, 4:49*pm, Boon wrote: Well, given global warming, pollution, and overpopulation issues, the whole planet is in decline. I am glad I do not have to worry about my non-existent children or grandchildren. And I am sure that your nonexistent grandchildren are equally overjoyed that they don't have to change your diapers, an act made even more difficult by your ridiculous clown costume. |
#23
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
In article
, Boon wrote: Bubblegum bands? Stuck in the early seventies. Stephen |
#24
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 11:33*am, MiNe 109 wrote:
In article , *Boon wrote: Bubblegum bands? Stuck in the early seventies. Indeed. Plus, he considers The Shins a "bubblegum" band. Compared to the ultra-serious, pretentious twaddle he listens to, maybe it is. |
#25
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 11:35*am, ScottW wrote:
On Jan 16, 7:33*am, Boon wrote: On Jan 16, 9:16*am, ScottW wrote: My anemic bassless speakers? Or the anemic baseless speakers I happened to be reviewing at the time? There is a difference. Both speakers you claimed you owned and bragged about the great accomodation deal you whored yourself to get on the bassless DeVores which you later faudulently claimed were flat to 30 Hz... and then added with "bass correction" which you didn't have. There are several mistakes in this paragraph: 1. Both? I believe you've heard more than two pairs of speakers at my house. 2. I did not get accommodation pricing on the DeVores, since they weren't mine. They belonged to Jeff; I simply used them for about 6 months. 3. The DeVores are NOT flat to 30 Hz. I never said they were. They do measure down to 38 Hz. So you lied. 4. Bass correction? What are you talking about? I've never used bass correction. By the way, I've never heard substantial, accurate bass in your house. So how would you know? *LoL. *Proving once again what you don't know with fools qualifiers like substantial. No. I and everyone else noticed that once your giant Legacy POS hit below 30 Hz, your walls started to rattle and buzz. You apologized then, remember? Of course not. That's because you're a lair. Unless, of course, you want to make a claim that your ESL-63s have accurate and substantial bass. LoL. I also remember when you heard the DeVores, you were very smitten. Were you lying? *You're confused again. With the way you continually distort the facts, it's no wonder. But you asked me to write down the URL for Devore before you left. |
#26
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
In article
, Boon wrote: On Jan 16, 11:33*am, MiNe 109 wrote: In article , *Boon wrote: Bubblegum bands? Stuck in the early seventies. Indeed. Plus, he considers The Shins a "bubblegum" band. Compared to the ultra-serious, pretentious twaddle he listens to, maybe it is. !!! Well, I haven't seen a Tiger Beat for years, so maybe he's seen them there. Stephen |
#27
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 15, 9:15*pm, MiNe 109 wrote:
In article , *Ferstler wrote: *but since I have been away for some time and have not bothered to even read any of the posts here that do not relate either to audio or to me, since some here seem to be obsessed with trashing me, I am not aware of Bret's social or political views. That's nuts. I just opened RAO in google groups and nine of ten topics listed were started by BL. Seven are completely off-topic and the two remaining are attack posts. I don't suppose you read RAO by google grouping your name? Stephen No, I have not read RAO for months and just dropped in last week to take a look around. I saw my name posted in the Google groups listing and clicked on the tab to see what it was referring to, and made some comments. I am not going to bother "google grouping" my name. Just not that interested. I do find it interesting that after several months I drop in and there is my name mentioned in some post. Hard to believe that I just happened to stumble onto a post with me as one of the topics, so I have to conclude that some of you here continue to post rants and commentaries about Ferstler on a regular basis. Hell, I am retired. (OK, AudioXpress is continuing to print some of the essays and reviews I wrote months ago.) Give it a rest and move onto something else. As for the obviously non-audio topics BL posted, and my not being aware of them, if those he posted have nothing to do with audio, I would not have bothered to take a look at them. Why shouild I, when this is an audio usenet group? If one wants to discuss politics on and on they should head to a group that concentrates on politics as a matter of usenet subject area. Doing it here seems a waste of energy and time. Howard Ferstler |
#28
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 11:35*am, ScottW wrote:
Both speakers you claimed you owned and bragged about the great accomodation deal you whored yourself to get on the bassless DeVores which you later faudulently claimed were flat to 30 Hz... and then added with "bass correction" which you didn't have. I just realized what you're talking about here. We were listening to the Zu Druids, and I mentioned that the larger model, the Definition, sounded its best when a bass equalizer was used. I told you that I had just visited another audio reviewer who had this set-up--my Yamamoto 45 amp on the midrange and tweeter and a Brinkmann integrated on the woofers--and was able to get flat bass down to almost 20 Hz. You seemed very interested in this setup and asked me a lot of questions. Five years later, you've twisted this so that it applies to the DeVores. See, this is the problem with you, Scott. You simply cannot be trusted to tell the truth. So you're either a liar (which you are, since I constantly catch you telling whoppers), or you have a serious mental handicap that prevents you from remembering things correctly. Which is it, moron? |
#29
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 1:22*pm, Ferstler wrote:
On Jan 15, 9:15*pm, MiNe 109 * wrote: In article , *Ferstler wrote: *but since I have been away for some time and have not bothered to even read any of the posts here that do not relate either to audio or to me, since some here seem to be obsessed with trashing me, I am not aware of Bret's social or political views. That's nuts. I just opened RAO in google groups and nine of ten topics listed were started by BL. Seven are completely off-topic and the two remaining are attack posts. I don't suppose you read RAO by google grouping your name? Stephen No, I have not read RAO for months and just dropped in last week to take ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ. |
#30
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 10:18*am, Boon wrote:
On Jan 15, 4:40*pm, Ferstler wrote: On Jan 15, 4:49*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 15, 2:36*pm, Ferstler wrote: I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members. Um, Harold...Bret is a blatant white supremacist who has been spamming this NG for quite some time with his *"nationalist" propaganda. If you think that's sane and honest, then you've sunk even lower than anyone imagined. On the other hand, he also tends to offer opinions of stereo gear (i.e. Harbeth, Koetsu) that he has never heard, and then lies about having heard them at nameless audio salons. That makes you two audio frauds quite the matched pair. Well, I certainly have no use for white supremacists (being a rather extreme Obama supporter, myself, and a borderline socialist when it comes to topics like medical and energy issues), but since I have been away for some time and have not bothered to even read any of the posts here that do not relate either to audio or to me, since some here seem to be obsessed with trashing me, I am not aware of Bret's social or political views. Frankly, it seems rather odd to me that a usenet group configured rec.audio.opinion would tolerate a multitude of posts that are not related to audio. I might as well post something off topic, anyway, and will note that I am certainly not an anti- nationalist, myself, although I am painfully aware that the USA, relative to the rest of the world, is in decline, and will continue to decline. Well, given global warming, pollution, and overpopulation issues, the whole planet is in decline. I am glad I do not have to worry about my non-existent children or grandchildren. I generally base my opinions of audio gear upon what I have actually heard (especially components that I have auditioned in my own listening rooms), although if seriously competent people like Nousaine, Pierce, Toole, or Rich put for strong opinions about gear I have not heard I will usually take what they say seriously. I continue to lament the fact that so many of you here consider me a fraud, particularly because so many of you have opinions based upon hearsay and not actually upon having read my books and review and commentary articles. Say, that situation kind of parallels what you say about Bret and his non-experience with certain audio components. Interestingly, the rancor here has often reached such a level that arguments are based simply upon not liking somebody just because they are supposed to not be liked. A kne-jerk approach is the norm. Actual issues relating to audio (dbt analyses, speaker comparing, surround technologies, design concepts, speaker/room behavior, etc.) are forgotten and the whole thing boils down to basic animosities in a kind of Hatfields vs McCoys style that has almost nothing to do with audio. This situation is almost painful to acknowledge, and is one reason I am simply not going to be drawn back into the backbiting series of insult swapping dialogs this site is notorious for. And yet you remain, making daily declarations that you're leaving, never to return. How sad.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - One of the interesting things about RAO (and I suppose other sites that appeal to back biters and those with not much else to do) is that the regulars make a point of posting insulting and insinuating comments in the hope of roping certain other participants into a lengthy and pointless series of insult swaps. I believe they do this, because they are lonely and even insult swapping makes them feel wanted. I hate to disappoint you, but even though I have hung around a bit longer than I intended, I do not intend to let your terminal comments about me get a running battle going. What I have done is make some points here that might give some of the newcomers an idea of just what you regulars are like. So, I leave the field to you and your misanthrope companions. Howard Ferstler |
#31
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
In article
, Ferstler wrote: As for the obviously non-audio topics BL posted, and my not being aware of them, if those he posted have nothing to do with audio, I would not have bothered to take a look at them. Why shouild I, when this is an audio usenet group? Perhaps to avoid putting your foot in your mouth in future by praising him for being on-topic. If one wants to discuss politics on and on they should head to a group that concentrates on politics as a matter of usenet subject area. Doing it here seems a waste of energy and time. If there were more audio, there would be more room for off-topic posting. Stephen |
#32
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 1:28*pm, Ferstler wrote:
On Jan 16, 10:18*am, Boon wrote: On Jan 15, 4:40*pm, Ferstler wrote: On Jan 15, 4:49*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 15, 2:36*pm, Ferstler wrote: I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members. Um, Harold...Bret is a blatant white supremacist who has been spamming this NG for quite some time with his *"nationalist" propaganda. If you think that's sane and honest, then you've sunk even lower than anyone imagined. On the other hand, he also tends to offer opinions of stereo gear (i.e. Harbeth, Koetsu) that he has never heard, and then lies about having heard them at nameless audio salons. That makes you two audio frauds quite the matched pair. Well, I certainly have no use for white supremacists (being a rather extreme Obama supporter, myself, and a borderline socialist when it comes to topics like medical and energy issues), but since I have been away for some time and have not bothered to even read any of the posts here that do not relate either to audio or to me, since some here seem to be obsessed with trashing me, I am not aware of Bret's social or political views. Frankly, it seems rather odd to me that a usenet group configured rec.audio.opinion would tolerate a multitude of posts that are not related to audio. I might as well post something off topic, anyway, and will note that I am certainly not an anti- nationalist, myself, although I am painfully aware that the USA, relative to the rest of the world, is in decline, and will continue to decline. Well, given global warming, pollution, and overpopulation issues, the whole planet is in decline. I am glad I do not have to worry about my non-existent children or grandchildren. I generally base my opinions of audio gear upon what I have actually heard (especially components that I have auditioned in my own listening rooms), although if seriously competent people like Nousaine, Pierce, Toole, or Rich put for strong opinions about gear I have not heard I will usually take what they say seriously. I continue to lament the fact that so many of you here consider me a fraud, particularly because so many of you have opinions based upon hearsay and not actually upon having read my books and review and commentary articles. Say, that situation kind of parallels what you say about Bret and his non-experience with certain audio components. Interestingly, the rancor here has often reached such a level that arguments are based simply upon not liking somebody just because they are supposed to not be liked. A kne-jerk approach is the norm. Actual issues relating to audio (dbt analyses, speaker comparing, surround technologies, design concepts, speaker/room behavior, etc.) are forgotten and the whole thing boils down to basic animosities in a kind of Hatfields vs McCoys style that has almost nothing to do with audio. This situation is almost painful to acknowledge, and is one reason I am simply not going to be drawn back into the backbiting series of insult swapping dialogs this site is notorious for. And yet you remain, making daily declarations that you're leaving, never to return. How sad.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - One of the interesting things about RAO (and I suppose other sites that appeal to back biters and those with not much else to do) is that the regulars make a point of posting insulting and insinuating comments in the hope of roping certain other participants into a lengthy and pointless series of insult swaps. I believe they do this, because they are lonely and even insult swapping makes them feel wanted. I hate to disappoint you, but even though I have hung around a bit longer than I intended, I do not intend to let your terminal comments about me get a running battle going. What I have done is make some points here that might give some of the newcomers an idea of just what you regulars are like. So, I leave the field to you and your misanthrope companions. Goodbye again, Harold, for the fifteenth time this week. How many times can the doorknob hit you in the ass before you see what a buffoon you are? |
#33
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 1:25*pm, Boon wrote:
See, this is the problem with you, Scott. You simply cannot be trusted to tell the truth. So you're either a liar (which you are, since I constantly catch you telling whoppers), or you have a serious mental handicap that prevents you from remembering things correctly. Which is it, moron? Can I venture a guess? |
#34
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 2:27*pm, "Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!"
wrote: On Jan 16, 1:25*pm, Boon wrote: See, this is the problem with you, Scott. You simply cannot be trusted to tell the truth. So you're either a liar (which you are, since I constantly catch you telling whoppers), or you have a serious mental handicap that prevents you from remembering things correctly. Which is it, moron? Can I venture a guess? Let me guess...lying moron? |
#35
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
Buffoon burbled:
How many times ... what a buffoon you are? Pot. Kettle. Etc. |
#36
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Liar Liar Pants On Fire Vinylsnatch Again
I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members. Um, Harold...Bret is a blatant white supremacist who has been spamming this NG for quite some time with his *"nationalist" propaganda. If you think that's sane and honest, then you've sunk even lower than anyone imagined. On the other hand, he also tends to offer opinions of stereo gear (i.e. Harbeth, Koetsu) that he has never heard, and then lies about having heard them at nameless audio salons. That makes you two audio frauds quite the matched pair. You know, V'n'l's'n'h, part of your problem is pure snobbery. Just because I live smack dab in the heart of flyover country you think I must not have access to such as Harbeth and Koetsu. Well, I live in the south end of a county packed full of doctors and lawyers and corporate executives and high roller sales types...(most) all of whom are yuppieish ****tards to compete with Orange and Westchester. There are historical reasons for this, try Googling the names "Pendergast" and "J.C.Nichols". Kansas City is a minor league town to be sure, on the whole, but like Nashville it has a bunch of New Affluence and a core of old banker money types. Since the end of Pendergast (Google also "That Goddamned Neck Tie Salesman", a fellow named Harry S (no period-just the letter S) Truman.) some of them went back to Missouri, but most are in a little patch just outside both Missouri and outside the reach of Kansas City, KS. It's big enough to effectively keep one house of the state legislature in check , and does just exactly what it-that is, the real estate developers, doctors, and lawyers-want it to do. But another part is sheer deviousness. You know that I am a white nationalist, NOT a white supremacist, and that I started posting tasty tidbits liberals don't like in response to liberal political harping and spamming. I was perfectly happy to discuss audio, provided it was audio and not look-at-my-expensive-name-brand-substitute-penis we were discussing. You know, your behavior here is what cost you the ToneAudio gig, and you haven't learned. Atkinson posts here, which I certainly wouldn't in his position, but he generally knows better to get in public ****ing matches with wascally wascists. |
#37
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Liar Liar Pants On Fire Ludwig Again
On Jan 17, 1:59*am, Bret L wrote:
I will answer you, because you post a valid question and seem considerably more sane and honest than most of the other site members.. Um, Harold...Bret is a blatant white supremacist who has been spamming this NG for quite some time with his *"nationalist" propaganda. If you think that's sane and honest, then you've sunk even lower than anyone imagined. On the other hand, he also tends to offer opinions of stereo gear (i.e. Harbeth, Koetsu) that he has never heard, and then lies about having heard them at nameless audio salons. That makes you two audio frauds quite the matched pair. *You know, V'n'l's'n'h, part of your problem is pure snobbery. Just because I live smack dab in the heart of flyover country you think I must not have access to such as Harbeth and Koetsu. That's a lie. I think you don't have access to Harbeth and Koetsu because whenever you bash those brands, you can't even name a model number, or where you listened to them, or what the rest of the system contained. It's only after I badger you that you come up with some quick lie that you can't back up. Well, I live in the south end of a county packed full of doctors and lawyers and corporate executives and high roller sales types...(most) all of whom are yuppieish ****tards to compete with Orange and Westchester. There are historical reasons for this, try Googling the names "Pendergast" and "J.C.Nichols". This has nothing to do with anything. I happen to know that you live near Acoustic Sounds, and since I know most of the principles there it's very easy for me to check your story out. *Kansas City is a minor league town to be sure, on the whole, but like Nashville it has a bunch of New Affluence and a core of old banker money types. Since the end of Pendergast (Google also "That Goddamned Neck Tie Salesman", a fellow named Harry S (no period-just the letter S) Truman.) some of them went back to Missouri, but most are in a little patch just outside both Missouri and outside the reach of Kansas City, KS. It's big enough to effectively keep one house of the state legislature in check , and does just exactly what it-that is, the real estate developers, doctors, and lawyers-want it to do. *But another part is sheer deviousness. You know that I am a white nationalist, NOT a white supremacist, and that I started posting tasty tidbits liberals don't like in response to liberal political harping and spamming. I was perfectly happy to discuss audio, provided it was audio and not look-at-my-expensive-name-brand-substitute-penis we were discussing. Well, no. You're spamming the group with OT topics and that's against the Usenet. This is a black and white issue. You're in the wrong, period. *You know, your behavior here is what cost you the ToneAudio gig, and you haven't learned. That would be another blatant lie. Nothing "cost" me the TONEAudio gig. I left on my own to pursue something else. End of story. Atkinson posts here, which I certainly wouldn't in his position, but he generally knows better to get in public ****ing matches with wascally wascists. Well, he's gotten into some ****ing matches here, but at the same time he's always been a gentleman. I, on the other hand, no longer have any professional ties to the audio community, so offensive Nazi trailer scum like yourself can kiss my hairy ass if you don't like what I say on RAO. |
#38
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Liar Liar Pants On Fire Ludwig Again
BaBoon howled:
You know, your behavior here is what cost you the ToneAudio gig Nothing "cost" me the TONEAudio gig. I left on my own to pursue something else. End of story. Another career "choice" down the toilet. Just another one in a long string of many. So, what else is new? |
#39
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 16, 2:39*pm, Boon wrote:
On Jan 16, 2:27*pm, "Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote: On Jan 16, 1:25*pm, Boon wrote: See, this is the problem with you, Scott. You simply cannot be trusted to tell the truth. So you're either a liar (which you are, since I constantly catch you telling whoppers), or you have a serious mental handicap that prevents you from remembering things correctly. Which is it, moron? Can I venture a guess? Let me guess...lying moron? Um, "Imbecile" was what I was thinking, but close enough... :-) |
#40
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Ferstler vs. AudioXPress
On Jan 17, 7:25*pm, "Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!"
wrote: On Jan 16, 2:39*pm, Boon wrote: On Jan 16, 2:27*pm, "Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote: On Jan 16, 1:25*pm, Boon wrote: See, this is the problem with you, Scott. You simply cannot be trusted to tell the truth. So you're either a liar (which you are, since I constantly catch you telling whoppers), or you have a serious mental handicap that prevents you from remembering things correctly. Which is it, moron? Can I venture a guess? Let me guess...lying moron? Um, "Imbecile" was what I was thinking, but close enough... :-) Lying imbecilic moron? Or moronically imbecilic liar? Or moronically lying imbecile? I vote for #3. It flows better. |
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