I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card. Is this card adequate or should I invest in
something better? Am I out of my mind for considering such an endeavor? I
also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any recommendations or warnings would be
greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Phil

"eblaster" wrote ...
I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card. Is this card adequate or should I invest
in something better? Am I out of my mind for considering such an
endeavor? I also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any recommendations or
warnings would be greatly appreciated.

The last Soundblaster Live I had to use had some sort of built-in
brickwall limiter. Even people who had no particular interest
in audio thought it sounded like $&|#.

I got rid of it as soon as I could find a screwdriver. A better sound
card would be advised. Fortunately, almost anything you can find
will be better.

Remember that you will need an RIAA Phono Preamp (unless you
have a turntable with a built-in preamp and line-level outputs.)

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 03:20:48 GMT, "eblaster"
wrote:

I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card. Is this card adequate or should I invest in
something better? Am I out of my mind for considering such an endeavor? I
also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any recommendations or warnings would be
greatly appreciated.

I'd advise upgrading to at least an Audigy, or ideally to a Lynx One,
and remember that you'll also need a RIAA (phono) preamp to raise the
signal to line level.
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

"eblaster" wrote in message
news:jaAld.503341$mD.189490@attbi_s02

I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card.

Depends which model of SoundBlaster Live!. The early ones were audibly
colored, but the current model (5.1) is pretty clean.

Is this card adequate or should I invest in something better? Am I out
of my mind for considering such
an endeavor?

Not, lots of people are doing this.

I also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any
recommendations or warnings would be greatly appreciated.

http://www.a-reny.com/iexplorer/restauration.html

http://www.delback.co.uk/lp-cdr.htm

thanks for your comments.

"eblaster" wrote in message
news:jaAld.503341$mD.189490@attbi_s02...
I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card. Is this card adequate or should I invest
in something better? Am I out of my mind for considering such an
endeavor? I also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any recommendations or
warnings would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Phil

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
I'd advise upgrading to at least an Audigy, or ideally to a Lynx One,
and remember that you'll also need a RIAA (phono) preamp to raise the
signal to line level.

A Lynx for vinyl transfer :-) What *massive* overkill!

Can you name *one* record/turntable/tonearm/cartridge/phono pre-amp
combination that outperforms a SB live A-D?

OTOH if you already have a $100,000 turntable rig, then buy a Lynx by all
means.

TonyP.

"TonyP" wrote in message
u
"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
I'd advise upgrading to at least an Audigy, or ideally to a Lynx One,
and remember that you'll also need a RIAA (phono) preamp to raise the
signal to line level.

A Lynx for vinyl transfer :-) What *massive* overkill!

Agreed.

Can you name *one* record/turntable/tonearm/cartridge/phono pre-amp
combination that outperforms a SB live A-D?

The needle-up noise from a very good phono preamp is usually higher.

OTOH if you already have a $100,000 turntable rig, then buy a Lynx by
all means.

....because at this point its all about bragging rights, not sound quality.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 18:49:40 +1100, "TonyP"
wrote:

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
.. .
I'd advise upgrading to at least an Audigy, or ideally to a Lynx One,
and remember that you'll also need a RIAA (phono) preamp to raise the
signal to line level.

A Lynx for vinyl transfer :-) What *massive* overkill!

Indeed, but it gives you that warm feeling that comes from knowing
that the card will never limit the sound quality!

Can you name *one* record/turntable/tonearm/cartridge/phono pre-amp
combination that outperforms a SB live A-D?

No, but I'll lay odds that the vinyl guys will! :-)

On a more serious note, I'd consider the old SB Live to be pretty
marginal on SNR, with some A/D artifacts that just might be audible.
Considering the relatively low cost of decent sound cards today, it
doesn't seem like much of an overall system expenditure to get a
really good one and not worry about any limitations from that
direction.

OTOH if you already have a $100,000 turntable rig, then buy a Lynx by all
means.

Those who have 'invested' in a Rockport Sirius III with an appropriate
cartridge, would no doubt consider the Lynx One to be barely adequate
to capture the 'magic of vinyl'.............
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 18:49:40 +1100, "TonyP"
A Lynx for vinyl transfer :-) What *massive* overkill!

Indeed, but it gives you that warm feeling that comes from knowing
that the card will never limit the sound quality!

Sure, if cost is not a consideration, it's a great card.

Can you name *one* record/turntable/tonearm/cartridge/phono pre-amp
combination that outperforms a SB live A-D?

No, but I'll lay odds that the vinyl guys will! :-)

I'll lay odds they can't.

On a more serious note, I'd consider the old SB Live to be pretty
marginal on SNR, with some A/D artifacts that just might be audible.

Maybe, but no where *NEAR* as audible as vinyl defects.
Vinyl apologists insist 60 dB SNR is more than required, and distortion is
irrelevant.

Considering the relatively low cost of decent sound cards today, it
doesn't seem like much of an overall system expenditure to get a
really good one and not worry about any limitations from that
direction.

But there are much more cost effective choices in between.

OTOH if you already have a $100,000 turntable rig, then buy a Lynx by all
means.

Those who have 'invested' in a Rockport Sirius III with an appropriate
cartridge, would no doubt consider the Lynx One to be barely adequate
to capture the 'magic of vinyl'.............

***FAR** more than adequate, but at least the cost is negligible compared to
the TT.

TonyP.

"eblaster" wrote in message
news:jaAld.503341$mD.189490@attbi_s02...
I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card. Is this card adequate or should I invest
in something better? Am I out of my mind for considering such an
endeavor? I also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any recommendations or
warnings would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Phil


Unless you love slaving away for hours and ending up with an inferior
result, go to a second-hand store and buy the CDs.

Or if they are unobtainable on CD, get a better soundcard such as M-Audio
Audiophile or many others. Just not a 'Creative' one.

geoff

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 03:20:48 GMT, "eblaster"
wrote:

I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card. Is this card adequate or should I invest
in
something better? Am I out of my mind for considering such an endeavor?
I
also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any recommendations or warnings would
be
greatly appreciated.

I'd advise upgrading to at least an Audigy, or ideally to a Lynx One,
and remember that you'll also need a RIAA (phono) preamp to raise the
signal to line level.


Audigy has the same problems as all the other SBs.

geoff

"TonyP" wrote in message
u...

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
I'd advise upgrading to at least an Audigy, or ideally to a Lynx One,
and remember that you'll also need a RIAA (phono) preamp to raise the
signal to line level.

A Lynx for vinyl transfer :-) What *massive* overkill!

Can you name *one* record/turntable/tonearm/cartridge/phono pre-amp
combination that outperforms a SB live A-D?

Not in s/n ratio or 'frequency response', no. But for added artifacts
anybody will benefit from a medium-quality soundcard in comparison.

OTOH if you already have a $100,000 turntable rig, then buy a Lynx by all
means.

A $100 (or less) turntable rig can still be compromised by a crap soundcard.

geoff

"TonyP" wrote in message news:4199d9d1$0$25117

Maybe, but no where *NEAR* as audible as vinyl defects.
Vinyl apologists insist 60 dB SNR is more than required, and distortion is
irrelevant.

Again, it's not the s/n , but the artifacts from anit-alias filtering and
internal resampling thru 48KHz. They are most unpleasant, and will not go
away if you upgrade your LP replay system to the foremention $100K one.

geoff

"Geoff Wood" -nospam wrote in message
...
Not in s/n ratio or 'frequency response', no. But for added artifacts
anybody will benefit from a medium-quality soundcard in comparison.

Of course, but will get more bang for their buck by starting with the
turntable and cartridge. The added artifacts are 30 to 50 dB greater in that
case.
I've measured a number of SB lives, and I'm not sure what artifacts you are
referring to though. 0.003% THD and 0.004% IMD is a number of orders of
magnitude better than vinyl. It gets a bit worse above 10 kHz, but still
orders of magnitude below vinyl.

A $100 (or less) turntable rig can still be compromised by a crap
soundcard.

What a laugh. The sound is so unlistenable to start with, if anything else
was added it may be an improvement :-)

If you have a $100 TT, not much point worrying about the soundcard, they
don't make any that bad !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

TonyP.

"Geoff Wood" -nospam wrote in message
...
Again, it's not the s/n , but the artifacts from anit-alias filtering and
internal resampling thru 48KHz. They are most unpleasant, and will not go
away if you upgrade your LP replay system to the foremention $100K one.

OK tell me just what level these artefacts are ?

Have you ever tried measuring the noise and distortion from a vinyl test
record at 16 kHz?
I have. It's not pretty!

TonyP.

"TonyP" wrote in message
...

"Geoff Wood" -nospam wrote in message
...
Again, it's not the s/n , but the artifacts from anit-alias filtering and
internal resampling thru 48KHz. They are most unpleasant, and will not
go
away if you upgrade your LP replay system to the foremention $100K one.

OK tell me just what level these artefacts are ?

Low level. They are there all the time

Have you ever tried measuring the noise and distortion from a vinyl test
record at 16 kHz?
I have. It's not pretty!

Yes. I have also listened to *music* from my turntable, and transcribed it
to CD. On SB and (more often) other cards. Generally teh distortion froma
phono system is in some way harmonically related to the exciting signal.
SRC artifacts are not.

I will concede however, that is you are happy with the quality of the
averabe MP3, then using the cheapest nastiest soundcard is not likely to be
a problem.

geoff

"Geoff Wood" -nospam wrote in message
...
OK tell me just what level these artefacts are ?
Low level. They are there all the time

Sure, about 30 or 40 dB below the noise level of vinyl.

Yes. I have also listened to *music* from my turntable, and transcribed
it
to CD. On SB and (more often) other cards. Generally teh distortion
froma
phono system is in some way harmonically related to the exciting signal.
SRC artifacts are not.

Neither is the wide band noise floor of vinyl. And the sound of cartridge
mistracking I find much more objectionable!
However you are ignoring the fact that SRC need not be done by the
soundblaster. One simply records at it's default 48 kHz, and does the SRC in
software. Voxengo make a good SRC which is FREE, called R8Brain. Recording
programs like Audition, Wavelab etc. do a good job by themselves.

I will concede however, that is you are happy with the quality of the
averabe MP3, then using the cheapest nastiest soundcard is not likely to
be
a problem.

Then you will concede that anyone happy with the inferior sound of vinyl,
will have no problem when using a SB live PROPERLY. Something you haven't
tried it seems.

Having said that, I must admit to using a much better pro sound card myself,
but still less than 1/10th the cost of my turntable. Only when you have a
good TT/cartridge/phono pre-amp do you need to worry about the soundcard.
But you're still limited by the quality of your records!

TonyP.

Wow, that was interesting and thanks for all the comments. I don't think
I'll bother with the transfer afterall.


"eblaster" wrote in message
news:jaAld.503341$mD.189490@attbi_s02...
I'm considering transferring my records to digital. I have a Creative
Soundblaster Live! audio card. Is this card adequate or should I invest
in something better? Am I out of my mind for considering such an
endeavor? I also have Roxio's CD Creator s/w. Any recommendations or
warnings would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Phil

"Geoff Wood" -nospam wrote in message


Yes. I have also listened to *music* from my turntable, and
transcribed it to CD. On SB and (more often) other cards.


Generally the distortion froma phono system is in some way harmonically
related
to the exciting signal. SRC artifacts are not.

The exact nature of SRC artifacts vary with the SRC. Often, they take the
form of random noise.