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#1
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Or are is the speaker level too high? I want to join together two
speaker cables. Would there be any appreciable loss in quality? What about tow different brands of cable? Thanks! |
#2
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
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#3
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
On Nov 28, 7:33 pm, wrote:
Or are is the speaker level too high? I want to join together two speaker cables. Would there be any appreciable loss in quality? What about tow different brands of cable? Thanks! Normally I'd say it's no problem but in-line 1/4" jacks (which are what make up such "couplers" make really poor contact with the plugs. I avoid them at all costs. Just get longer speaker cables. Your reputation will thank you. If you were talking about Speakon couplers, well, OK, that's a different story. No sweat. |
#4
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
In article ,
wrote: Or are is the speaker level too high? I want to join together two speaker cables. Would there be any appreciable loss in quality? What about tow different brands of cable? Thanks! Are you referring to female-to-female barrel connectors? Some of the cheapies are pretty flimsy inside, but the Switchcraft ones are probably heavy enough to use for speaker line. Really, though quarter-inch is a bad idea for speaker cables, especially if you're going to be chaining them. The Speakon connector is a lot more solid and won't fail or fall out. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#5
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Scott Dorsey wrote:
In article , wrote: Or are is the speaker level too high? I want to join together two speaker cables. Would there be any appreciable loss in quality? What about tow different brands of cable? Thanks! Are you referring to female-to-female barrel connectors? Some of the cheapies are pretty flimsy inside, but the Switchcraft ones are probably heavy enough to use for speaker line. Really, though quarter-inch is a bad idea for speaker cables, especially if you're going to be chaining them. The Speakon connector is a lot more solid and won't fail or fall out. Especially as a 1/4" barrel connector (or any 1/4 socket for that matter) may short circuit your amp if cable slightly tugged. Replace it all with speakons where possible ! geoff |
#6
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
On Nov 28, 7:33 pm, wrote:
Or are is the speaker level too high? I want to join together two speaker cables. Would there be any appreciable loss in quality? What about tow different brands of cable? Thanks! The coupler will probably work ok, but don't use guitar cable to connect your speakers, or else your amp will soon be in the shop! -Neb |
#7
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable asan 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Prior to the advent of speakons (not all that long ago) many pro systems
did use [!! 14" jacks !!] for speaker connections. LMAO |
#8
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
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#9
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Airbus wrote: Prior to the advent of speakons (not all that long ago) many pro systems did use 14" jacks for speaker connections. It does work. They used XLRs actually. Jacks are incapable of carrying the high currents typically associated with pro speaker systems. The actually get hot from the contact resistance. Potentially hot enough to give you a burn. Graham |
#10
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Eeyore wrote:
Airbus wrote: Prior to the advent of speakons (not all that long ago) many pro systems did use 14" jacks for speaker connections. It does work. They used XLRs actually. That too, although it's more rare. Also Hubbell twist-lock power connectors and occasionally military A&N connectors. Jacks are incapable of carrying the high currents typically associated with pro speaker systems. The actually get hot from the contact resistance. Potentially hot enough to give you a burn. Been there, done that. It happens a lot, and people still use them all the time. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#11
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
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#12
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
"Jack" wrote in message
In article , (Scott Dorsey) wrote: Eeyore wrote: Airbus wrote: Prior to the advent of speakons (not all that long ago) many pro systems did use 14" jacks for speaker connections. It does work. They used XLRs actually. That too, although it's more rare. Also Hubbell twist-lock power connectors and occasionally military A&N connectors. Jacks are incapable of carrying the high currents typically associated with pro speaker systems. The actually get hot from the contact resistance. Potentially hot enough to give you a burn. Been there, done that. It happens a lot, and people still use them all the time. I dunno, Marshall has been using 1/4 inch jacks in their amps forever with nary a problem. And some of those amps are 100 watt (8 ohm) to 350 watts. 100 wpc to 350 wpc amps are small by modern live sound standards. Medium is a few thousand watts. It takes many thousands of watts for an amp to be considered large, and that's for just a single amp. Modern live sound can easily involve banks of large amps. |
#13
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
On Nov 29, 8:37 am, Airbus wrote:
Well, few people use Speakons for unbalanced line-leve connections, so the OP was probably not referring to these. But the original poster was talking about speaker cables. Prior to the advent of speakons (not all that long ago) many pro systems did use 14" jacks for speaker connections. It does work. And this is what I believe he's talking about. He did ask "... or are the SPEAKER levels too high?" |
#14
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:03:32 -0800 (PST), nebulax
wrote: The coupler will probably work ok, but don't use guitar cable to connect your speakers, or else your amp will soon be in the shop! Probably won't actually. They aren't recommended, but will in practice work just fine :-) If one did short out, it shouldn't be disastrous to a modern amplifier. |
#15
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable asan 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Laurence Payne wrote:
The coupler will probably work ok, but don't use guitar cable to connect your speakers, or else your amp will soon be in the shop! Probably won't actually. They aren't recommended, but will in practice work just fine :-) If one did short out, it shouldn't be disastrous to a modern amplifier. I will admit to having done it, before I went into sales and warned people of the perils of doing it. |
#16
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 22:54:32 -0500, D C wrote:
The coupler will probably work ok, but don't use guitar cable to connect your speakers, or else your amp will soon be in the shop! Probably won't actually. They aren't recommended, but will in practice work just fine :-) If one did short out, it shouldn't be disastrous to a modern amplifier. I will admit to having done it, before I went into sales and warned people of the perils of doing it. What disasters have you experienced due to using a signal cable for a speaker connection? |
#17
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
On Nov 30, 4:05 am, Laurence Payne NOSPAMlpayne1ATdsl.pipex.com
wrote: What disasters have you experienced due to using a signal cable for a speaker connection? Not real disasters (never saw one burst into flame) but quite possibly degradation. Small signal cable is typically 18 to 22 gauge wire. The nicely made non-ripoff rubber or neoprene jacketed cable with 1/4" plugs on both ends that's sold in a music store as "speaker cable" is 16 gauge and occasionally 14 gauge. If you know where to look, you can get cable with 12 gauge wire. Switchcraft makes a 1/4" phone plug that has a fat back shell with a big hole to accommodate heavy gauge wire. The bigger the wire (the smaller the gauge number) the less voltage drop for a given length and current. If you were using an 18 gauge wire a foot long to go between a guitar amplifier head and speaker cabinet, it would probably work just fine. But if you were to run 100 feet of that same cable to speaker cabinets capable of sucking up 200 watts on peaks, you wouldn't get all of that power down to the speaker end of the cable. Some would be dissipated as heat in the cable itself (and you can't hear that). While the actual load impedance of a loudspeaker varies all over the place with frequency, if you use the nominal (typically 8 or 4 ohms) impedance and amplifier power (assuming the speaker won't blow at full amplifier power) you can use Ohm's Law to calculate the current. Using a copper wire table (or an ohm meter) to figure out the resistance of the cable, you can then calculate how many volts will get to the speaker and how many will be lost to heating up the room with the cable. The issue of the 1/4" cable is another thing. I've never noticed one that's become warm from the current, but I'll take Scott's word for it. If I found one like that, I'd suspect that several strands of wire had broken inside the connector shell and it was a very short piece of high resistance wire that was generating local heat rather than the jack contacts. |
#18
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable asan 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Laurence Payne wrote:
Probably won't actually. They aren't recommended, but will in practice work just fine :-) If one did short out, it shouldn't be disastrous to a modern amplifier. I will admit to having done it, before I went into sales and warned people of the perils of doing it. What disasters have you experienced due to using a signal cable for a speaker connection? None. |
#19
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Mike Rivers wrote:
On Nov 30, 4:05 am, Laurence Payne NOSPAMlpayne1ATdsl.pipex.com wrote: What disasters have you experienced due to using a signal cable for a speaker connection? Not real disasters (never saw one burst into flame) but quite possibly degradation. I had someone at a festival come to me and ask to borrow a 1/4 to 1/4 patch cable, so I loaned him a Whirlwind one. He brought it back a couple hours later, saying it had failed. Turned out he was using it for speaker signals, and it did indeed fail. What's interesting is that the 24ga center conductor is open somewhere in the middle. This is the SAME person who a decade earlier asked me for a piece of wire, which he used to replace a blown fuse in an amplifier. After doing this, he came to me complaining that smoke had come out of the amp when he did this. If he'd asked for a fuse, or told me what he was doing with the wire, I'd have given him the proper fuse out of my kit. Sheesh. Maybe I should stop loaning him anything. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#20
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
... On Nov 30, 4:05 am, Laurence Payne NOSPAMlpayne1ATdsl.pipex.com wrote: What disasters have you experienced due to using a signal cable for a speaker connection? Not real disasters (never saw one burst into flame) but quite possibly degradation. I do this every now and then for my wee monitors, driving a whopping 100 watts each :-) A short cord with low wattage is probably fine. A long cord with 'real' wattage is just a combined low pass filter & fuse. Sean |
#21
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Airbus wrote:
Some of you people need to get out more. Speakons are a fairly recent invention (1990's) This is true, but they sure have caught on fast. All of the high-powered '60's/70's venues, from Allman bros to Fillmore East, from Grateful Dead and Cream to Mahavishnu Orchestra used speaker systems connected either with screw terminals, or more commonly 1/4" jacks. That's a lot of sound for something "incapable" of the job. . . Most of those guys used screw terminals or banana plugs, and the higher powered systems were often built with Hubbel twist-locks. When biamping started to come in, the twist-locks became that much more popular since you could get them up to six pin varieties. But yes, 1/4" phone plugs were very popular for many years, and they failed a lot and were a big headache. Still used extensively today They sure are, and it drives me up the wall. But then, I also remember a band in the early eighties that was using 1/4" plugs for high-Z guitar lines, unbalanced microphone lines, AC power, and speaker signals. Needless to say the expected disasters happened. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#22
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
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#23
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Laurence Payne NOSPAMlpayne1ATdsl.pipex.com wrote:
On 1 Dec 2007 14:04:11 -0500, (Scott Dorsey) wrote: But yes, 1/4" phone plugs were very popular for many years, and they failed a lot and were a big headache. Still used extensively today They sure are, and it drives me up the wall. But then, I also remember a band in the early eighties that was using 1/4" plugs for high-Z guitar lines, unbalanced microphone lines, AC power, and speaker signals. Needless to say the expected disasters happened. AC power? 120VAC. Sleeve is white, tip is black. It's perfectly safe as long as you don't touch any connectors ever, or let them touch the ground or a case or anything else. And you don't ever plug them in.... and.... --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#24
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
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#25
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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Can I use the same kind of coupler for a 1/4" speaker cable as an 1/4" unbalanced line-level cable?
Airbus wrote:
Some of you people need to get out more. Speakons are a fairly recent invention (1990's) All of the high-powered '60's/70's venues, from Allman bros to Fillmore East, from Grateful Dead and Cream to Mahavishnu Orchestra used speaker systems connected either with screw terminals, or more commonly 1/4" jacks. That's a lot of sound for something "incapable" of the job. . . 4 pin xlr's are/were handy, also for biamping, 4 X 1 mm square rubber insulated fits, tightly but it fits. Still used extensively today no comment. Kind regards Peter Larsen |
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