[Carey Carlan]

I just inherited a 4-foot shelf of records in various conditions.
Mostly LP's, but some 78's and 45's, too. Most are filthy. I want to
clean them before I play them.

Is my best solution to get something good off eBay, use it then auction
it off again?

I won't find a Keith Monks machine. All I see are new Nitty Gritty
machines. What's out there that's worth having?

Other ideas?

[Scott Dorsey]

Carey Carlan wrote:
I just inherited a 4-foot shelf of records in various conditions.
Mostly LP's, but some 78's and 45's, too. Most are filthy. I want to
clean them before I play them.

Is my best solution to get something good off eBay, use it then auction
it off again?

Clean them in the sink with a good laboratory cleaner like Alconox or
Sparkleen. Towel them dry with a clean towel that is old enough to be
fairly lint-free. Put them in new rice paper sleeves.

THEN after they are that clean, run them through the record cleaning
machine.

I won't find a Keith Monks machine. All I see are new Nitty Gritty
machines. What's out there that's worth having?

They are all fine. The Nitty Gritty Record Doctor is the cheapest machine
made, it turns up used, and it is fine. The more expensive VPI and Nitty
Gritty machines are no more effective but they are faster and easier to use
if you have a lot of records to do.

If you have filthy records, prewash them. And don't ever put shellac 78s
into one of the vacuum machines because they will gum the machines up...
they shed so much metal powder even when you think they are clean.

The machine will cost you a lot less money than the sleeves.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Keith.]

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
Carey Carlan wrote:
I just inherited a 4-foot shelf of records in various conditions.
Mostly LP's, but some 78's and 45's, too. Most are filthy. I want to
clean them before I play them.

Is my best solution to get something good off eBay, use it then auction
it off again?

Clean them in the sink with a good laboratory cleaner like Alconox or
Sparkleen. Towel them dry with a clean towel that is old enough to be
fairly lint-free. Put them in new rice paper sleeves.

THEN after they are that clean, run them through the record cleaning
machine.

I won't find a Keith Monks machine. All I see are new Nitty Gritty
machines. What's out there that's worth having?

They are all fine. The Nitty Gritty Record Doctor is the cheapest machine
made, it turns up used, and it is fine. The more expensive VPI and Nitty
Gritty machines are no more effective but they are faster and easier to
use
if you have a lot of records to do.

If you have filthy records, prewash them. And don't ever put shellac 78s
into one of the vacuum machines because they will gum the machines up...
they shed so much metal powder even when you think they are clean.

The machine will cost you a lot less money than the sleeves.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

For really dirty vinyl, an ultrasonic cleaner as Scott suggested previously,
would be really helpful.
Try Ultrasonic Cleaner for vinyl cleaning
I like the fish tank cleaner idea.
Good luck,

Keith.

[Keith.]

"Keith." wrote in message
...

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
Carey Carlan wrote:
I just inherited a 4-foot shelf of records in various conditions.
Mostly LP's, but some 78's and 45's, too. Most are filthy. I want to
clean them before I play them.

Is my best solution to get something good off eBay, use it then auction
it off again?

Clean them in the sink with a good laboratory cleaner like Alconox or
Sparkleen. Towel them dry with a clean towel that is old enough to be
fairly lint-free. Put them in new rice paper sleeves.

THEN after they are that clean, run them through the record cleaning
machine.

I won't find a Keith Monks machine. All I see are new Nitty Gritty
machines. What's out there that's worth having?

They are all fine. The Nitty Gritty Record Doctor is the cheapest
machine
made, it turns up used, and it is fine. The more expensive VPI and Nitty
Gritty machines are no more effective but they are faster and easier to
use
if you have a lot of records to do.

If you have filthy records, prewash them. And don't ever put shellac 78s
into one of the vacuum machines because they will gum the machines up...
they shed so much metal powder even when you think they are clean.

The machine will cost you a lot less money than the sleeves.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

For really dirty vinyl, an ultrasonic cleaner as Scott suggested
previously, would be really helpful.
Try Ultrasonic Cleaner for vinyl cleaning
I like the fish tank cleaner idea.
Good luck,

Keith.

Try http://www.geocities.com/drpaulng/2U...icCleaner.html

[Paul Stamler[_2_]]

"Carey Carlan" wrote in message
...
I just inherited a 4-foot shelf of records in various conditions.
Mostly LP's, but some 78's and 45's, too. Most are filthy. I want to
clean them before I play them.

Is my best solution to get something good off eBay, use it then auction
it off again?

I won't find a Keith Monks machine. All I see are new Nitty Gritty
machines. What's out there that's worth having?

VPI. Get the one with the heavy-duty motor, so the heat sensor won't cut out
after fifteen minutes.

Also...cleaning solutions for 33s, 45s and 78s differ. You can use alcohol
with 33s, in moderation, but you must NEVER use it with shellac 78s, as
it'll dissolve them. Not sure about 45s but my gut sense is that alcohol's
probably not great for them either.

Peace,
Paul

[Adrian Tuddenham[_2_]]

Paul Stamler wrote:

"Carey Carlan" wrote in message
...
I just inherited a 4-foot shelf of records in various conditions.
Mostly LP's, but some 78's and 45's, too. Most are filthy. I want to
clean them before I play them.

Is my best solution to get something good off eBay, use it then auction
it off again?

I won't find a Keith Monks machine. All I see are new Nitty Gritty
machines. What's out there that's worth having?

VPI. Get the one with the heavy-duty motor, so the heat sensor won't cut out
after fifteen minutes.

Also...cleaning solutions for 33s, 45s and 78s differ. You can use alcohol
with 33s, in moderation, but you must NEVER use it with shellac 78s, as
it'll dissolve them. Not sure about 45s but my gut sense is that alcohol's
probably not great for them either.

45s are usually the same vinyl mix as 33s, so you can treat them the
same way.

Nitrates ("acetates") also dissolve in alcohol. Play them while they
are still wet after washing; as they dry, they lose plasticiser and
become noiser. Keep them moist on the turntable with a deionised water
spray (cover up the electrics) but don't leave them wet for longer than
15 minutes and don't play them more than twice if you can help it.

Beware of gelatine-on-glass 78s (direct cut), they dissolve in water and
shrivel in alcohol.

Laminated 78s (UK Columbias and Regals from 1921 to 1931) contain a
paper layer and some of the cheaper makes of solid stock pressing
contain significant amounts of cotton flock. Both materials can swell
and cause problems if the records are kept wet for too long.


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Carey Carlan]

lid (Adrian Tuddenham) wrote in
nvalid.invalid:

45s are usually the same vinyl mix as 33s, so you can treat them
the same way.

Thanks, that helps.

Nitrates ("acetates") also dissolve in alcohol. Play them while
they are still wet after washing; as they dry, they lose
plasticiser and become noiser. Keep them moist on the turntable
with a deionised water spray (cover up the electrics) but don't
leave them wet for longer than 15 minutes and don't play them
more than twice if you can help it.

Beware of gelatine-on-glass 78s (direct cut), they dissolve in water
and shrivel in alcohol.

Laminated 78s (UK Columbias and Regals from 1921 to 1931) contain a
paper layer and some of the cheaper makes of solid stock pressing
contain significant amounts of cotton flock. Both materials can swell
and cause problems if the records are kept wet for too long.

I don't see anything but "standard" look 78's in the collection. I
assume nitrate, glass, and paper records look different somehow from the
usual black, hard 78's I know and love...

[William Sommerwerck]

45s are usually the same vinyl mix as 33s, so you can
treat them the same way.

Cheap ones are styrene. I don't know how styrene is affected by alcohols.

[William Sommerwerck]

There's something wrong with a Nitty-Gritty? I have one.

Records can be washed at the sink with liquid detergent and lukewarm tap
water. You should use one of the cleaning brushes (fabric or bristle) from
Nitty-Gritty to loosen the shmutz.

http://www.nittygrittyinc.com/more_accessories.htm

Phonograph records should be cleaned only when it's needed. Cleaning them
every time you play them is a waste of time, and might accelerate their
wear/aging.

[Adrian Tuddenham[_2_]]

Carey Carlan wrote:

lid (Adrian Tuddenham) wrote in
nvalid.invalid:

45s are usually the same vinyl mix as 33s, so you can treat them
the same way.

Thanks, that helps.

See th cautionary post about Styrene by William Sommerwerck - I wasn't
aware of Styrene records.

Nitrates ("acetates") also dissolve in alcohol. Play them while
they are still wet after washing; as they dry, they lose
plasticiser and become noiser. Keep them moist on the turntable
with a deionised water spray (cover up the electrics) but don't
leave them wet for longer than 15 minutes and don't play them
more than twice if you can help it.

Beware of gelatine-on-glass 78s (direct cut), they dissolve in water
and shrivel in alcohol.

Laminated 78s (UK Columbias and Regals from 1921 to 1931) contain a
paper layer and some of the cheaper makes of solid stock pressing
contain significant amounts of cotton flock. Both materials can swell
and cause problems if the records are kept wet for too long.

I don't see anything but "standard" look 78's in the collection. I
assume nitrate, glass, and paper records look different somehow from the
usual black, hard 78's I know and love...

A glint of the base material, aluminium or glass, showing at the inside
edge of the centre hole, is usually the first indication that the record
is not a standard solid-stock pressing. A second hole or set of three
holes about an inch from the centre is a clear indication that it is a
'direct cut' disc which needs special treatment.

Check for gelatine by pressing a saliva-moistened finger on an
unrecorded bit of the surface. If the wet rolls up in balls , it is
probably safe to wash the disc in water; but if it soaks in, or the
surface goes tacky, suspect gelatine.

A Columbia/Regal laminate often has a slightly mottled or ripply surface
when light is reflected off it.

Thee are other types of record material, such as chocolate or hard
playback wax, but they are very rare and you don't normally need to
worry about them.


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Scott Dorsey]

Paul Stamler wrote:

Also...cleaning solutions for 33s, 45s and 78s differ. You can use alcohol
with 33s, in moderation, but you must NEVER use it with shellac 78s, as
it'll dissolve them. Not sure about 45s but my gut sense is that alcohol's
probably not great for them either.

There are two kinds of 45s: the vinyl ones and the styrene ones. I have
always used standard 25% isopropanol solution on both of them without any
problems, but a plastics guy might know if there are any styrene issues.

The styrene 45s are usually so horribly munged up by the time that I see
them that damage from cleaning solutions is the least of the worries.

I would not put any 78s through a cleaning machine, personally. Even a
very clean 78s is pretty filthy and is apt to gum the machine up.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Scott Dorsey]

Carey Carlan wrote:

I don't see anything but "standard" look 78's in the collection. I
assume nitrate, glass, and paper records look different somehow from the
usual black, hard 78's I know and love...

Look for records that are either much lighter or heavier than regular 78s,
have a hand-written label, and/or have a band of aluminum visible on the
outer edge.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Adrian Tuddenham[_2_]]

Scott Dorsey wrote:

Carey Carlan wrote:

I don't see anything but "standard" look 78's in the collection. I
assume nitrate, glass, and paper records look different somehow from the
usual black, hard 78's I know and love...

Look for records that are either much lighter or heavier than regular 78s,
have a hand-written label, and/or have a band of aluminum visible on the
outer edge.

A lot of the British nitrates were rotary dip-coated, so the aluminium
doesn't show at the edge on that type - but it always shows at the
centre hole.


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Carey Carlan]

(Scott Dorsey) wrote in
:

Carey Carlan wrote:

I don't see anything but "standard" look 78's in the collection. I
assume nitrate, glass, and paper records look different somehow from
the usual black, hard 78's I know and love...

Look for records that are either much lighter or heavier than regular
78s, have a hand-written label, and/or have a band of aluminum visible
on the outer edge.
--scott

And Scott,

What is the advantage of rice paper sleeves? Wouldn't a plastic lined
paper sleeve do just as well?

[Carey Carlan]

"William Sommerwerck" wrote in
:

There's something wrong with a Nitty-Gritty? I have one.

Nothing wrong with them. But I was looking through eBay for a used one
so I could resell it for approximately what I paid for it, and all I
found were NEW Nitty Gritty machines.

Records can be washed at the sink with liquid detergent and lukewarm
tap water. You should use one of the cleaning brushes (fabric or
bristle) from Nitty-Gritty to loosen the shmutz.

http://www.nittygrittyinc.com/more_accessories.htm

Phonograph records should be cleaned only when it's needed. Cleaning
them every time you play them is a waste of time, and might accelerate
their wear/aging.

I have never washed any of my records. They go from the sleeve to the
turntable then (usually) immediately back to the shelf.

The records in question are newly arrived and filthy. They haven't had
the care of my own stock.

[William Sommerwerck]

What is the advantage of rice paper sleeves? Wouldn't
a plastic-lined paper sleeve do just as well?

Reduced static, I believe.

[Scott Dorsey]

Carey Carlan wrote:
(Scott Dorsey) wrote in

And Scott,

What is the advantage of rice paper sleeves? Wouldn't a plastic lined
paper sleeve do just as well?

Anti-static. And they are not expensive.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Paul Stamler[_2_]]

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...

I would not put any 78s through a cleaning machine, personally. Even a
very clean 78s is pretty filthy and is apt to gum the machine up.

I've done it with a couple of VPI machines, never had any problems. For a
cleaning solution, I used distilled water with a couple of drops of Kodak
Photo-Flo.

Peace,
Paul

[Karl Uppiano[_2_]]

"Carey Carlan" wrote in message
...
I just inherited a 4-foot shelf of records in various conditions.
Mostly LP's, but some 78's and 45's, too. Most are filthy. I want to
clean them before I play them.

Is my best solution to get something good off eBay, use it then auction
it off again?

I won't find a Keith Monks machine. All I see are new Nitty Gritty
machines. What's out there that's worth having?

Other ideas?

I know this will seem like heresy, but I have been cleaning records with tap
water and dish soap for 30 years. I mix up a dilute concentration of Dawn
liquid (or equivalent) in lukewarm water. Then I soak a microfiber cleaning
cloth in the solution (I used to use a Watts disk washing brush, but they're
no longer available, AFAIK), and use it to simultaneously wipe both sides of
the record, running in the same direction as the grooves. I make sure the
solution "wets" the entire playing surface. If it doesn't, I add more
detergent, and apply it again. Then I rinse both sides in lukewarm water
from a gently running tap. I do this over the kitchen sink. I try to avoid
wetting the label, but a little water on the label rarely seems to matter
after it dries. After rinsing, the water should bead up into droplets and
fall right off. If the water still "wets" the surface, you haven't rinsed
off all the detergent. After shaking it off, if I want to accelerate drying,
I wipe the record with a dry microfiber cloth.

In this process, I use my bare hands, previously washed in detergent to
remove excess oils, but I also use "proper record handling techniques" to
hold the record while cleaning it, e.g., I only touch the record at the
center and the edges.

As I say, I have done this more or less the same way for over 30 years, and
my records have not suffered for it, and it is extremely cheap, with no
fancy machines or solutions. Back in the 70's when they were making vinyl
records out of floor sweepings and axle grease (during the oil shortage), I
used to wash a new record before I played it (or maybe right afterward upon
listening to the surface noise, and knocking the waxy crud off my stylus).
Results were much better after the dish soap treatment.

[nebulax]

On Jan 6, 1:24*pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
What is the advantage of rice paper sleeves? Wouldn't
a plastic-lined paper sleeve do just as well?

Reduced static, I believe.


The residue from a plastic-lined sleeve can leech out after awhile,
and actually get stuck to the record. Regular paper sleeves are bad in
their own way, due to lint, static, friction, dirt, etc. Rice paper is
good, and I wish someone would make a 12" version of the anti-static
Tyvek sleeves I've seen for CDs.

-Neb