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#1
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
Just added this for VO work - but no matter how hot the input seems to
be on the box, the max level I can get in either Sound Forge or Goldwave is -6dB. Updated drivers, firmware, all is up to date and correct...Somewhere in the manual it says that the default setting is for the output to be attenuated by 6dB - is this referring to the 8 1/4" outputs on the box itself or the digital output going thru the firewire? Nothing else refers to this situation, nor can I find anything on the Web - help?? TIA. |
#2
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
Chris/Power Salad wrote:
Just added this for VO work - but no matter how hot the input seems to be on the box, What is the status indication on the software mixer and is there a setting there that reduces the level? Peter Larsen |
#3
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
Everything in the software interface for the 410 is at max, all
"faders" etc. Tried it in both SF and Goldwave so I know it's not the program, but am not getting nearly as hot signals recorded as I had when using a Behringer board and a Roland USB interface, even when the box is peaking, I can't record any hotter than -6dB. Any way I can get more gain would be great, unless that's it, in which case.... |
#4
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
Chris/Power Salad wrote: Everything in the software interface for the 410 is at max, all "faders" etc. Tried it in both SF and Goldwave so I know it's not the program, but am not getting nearly as hot signals recorded as I had when using a Behringer board and a Roland USB interface, even when the box is peaking, I can't record any hotter than -6dB. You said the manual said something about this? I suppose that it wouldn't be out of the question that they set the input sensitivity of the A/D stage so that the analog clipping level corresponds to -6 dBFS. This would prevent what most people are afriad of - digital clipping. Though you could get analog clipping trying to achieve full scale peaks. There may be an internal jumper that "fixes" this for those who are keen enough to properly set recording level. I would suggest contacting M-Audio, but nobody seems to have much luck getting real technical info from any of the high-volume-low-cost manufacturers these days, or they live in Outer Bivalvenia where long distance phone charges are exhorbitant. However, I'd suggest that you not worry about this as long as your recordings aren't distorted and there's no indication that anything else is wrong. 6 dB is a good safety margin. These days, it's expected that every finished product will be "mastered" to some extent or other, and that's where you can increase the peak level to full scale (as well as push up the average level). You're only giving up one bit by leaving 6 dB margin, and with 24-bit recording, that's still at least 20 dB below the noise level. |
#5
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
On 12 Dec 2006 15:27:53 -0800, "Mike Rivers"
wrote: However, I'd suggest that you not worry about this as long as your recordings aren't distorted and there's no indication that anything else is wrong. 6 dB is a good safety margin. These days, it's expected that every finished product will be "mastered" to some extent or other, and that's where you can increase the peak level to full scale (as well as push up the average level). You're only giving up one bit by leaving 6 dB margin, and with 24-bit recording, that's still at least 20 dB below the noise level. If I was getting that in the overall that'd be great, but the actual average level of my VOs is now like -21 to -15, with the aforementioned -6 peaks being only when the clip light on the box comes on (during testing with an aggressive "CHECK - CHECK", which of course I only did like once) but at my normal speaking level it's WAY below that. I can always raise it thru compression as you said, but I'm just a little concerned that I was getting better and hotter recordings with older/cheaper equipment, this even makes my AT4040 sound a bit muddy. No idea, perhaps I should've saved up for a Voicemaster Pro or whatever that box is...I'm still stumped, as I know of another VO guy in my area who is using the M-Audio Solo and doing very well evidently, I figured it'd use the same or better pre's...again, no idea, but I may have to go back to the other method for now... Thanks for the reply. |
#6
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
Chris/Power Salad wrote:
If I was getting that in the overall that'd be great, but the actual average level of my VOs is now like -21 to -15, with the aforementioned -6 peaks being only when the clip light on the box comes on (during testing with an aggressive "CHECK - CHECK", which of course I only did like once) but at my normal speaking level it's WAY below that. I can always raise it thru compression as you said, but You don't need compression to raise level. How about putting some energy into contacting M-Audio support and asking them? Peter Larsen |
#7
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
Chris/Power Salad wrote: If I was getting that in the overall that'd be great, but the actual average level of my VOs is now like -21 to -15, with the aforementioned -6 peaks being only when the clip light on the box comes on (during testing with an aggressive "CHECK - CHECK", which of course I only did like once) OK, pretty much confirms my suspicion that the A/D input sensitivity is set to be "digital safe" rather than allowing it to reach full scale. This is pretty dumb IMHO, so either there's simply something wroing with your interface or there's a button or a jumper on there somewhere that you can use to change that. This sounds like a job for M-Audio Tech Support. And thank you for not asking "Is this normal?". It would be helpful if you could perform a more scientific test than just yelling "CHECK" until the red light comes on. Do you have a signal generator? Or a keyboard that you can wedge down a key and get a steady tone? Many DAW programs have a waveform generator function that allows you to make a WAV file of a steady sine wave that you can burn on a CD and use a CD player as a generator. Anyway, connect a steady tone to the line input, adjust the input level control on the interface so the red light just comes on (according to the manual, this is 3 dB below the clip level) and record the tone. Read the DAW's meter and look at the level in the waveform view. That will tell you what's really happening. It's possible that you're just a victim of crappy metering (two LEDs on the M-Audio box doesn't make it very easy to set the input level) and/or not enough mic preamp gain. Or there could be something wrong, or unusual about the hardware. I know that people are reluctant to turn a knob up all the way, but what happens when you do that on the FW-410? Can you get the red light to flash on peaks of your normal voiceover voice? If not, you don't have enough gain. What you really need to know isn't in the spec sheet. "66 dB available preamp gain" doesn't mean much without knowing how this relates to the digital level. |
#8
Posted to rec.audio.pro
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M-Audio FW 410 level question - anyone?
I can certainly do some further testing and contacting support (and I
realize saying CHECK was only the quick & dirty method, I do have a synth I can use to generate a tone), however it appears simply that this box isn't for me, it seems to be coloring the tone of my mic in ways that my previous cheepo audio chain didn't. When I was recording "CHECK", the clip light on the 410 was lighting up but the wave in SF stopped at -6 and was distorted (analog from the input stage)., so something seemed mismatched. I appreciate all the info from everyone, if I don't get some sort of fix from M-Audio I suppose I'll go back to my old chain til I can get a better FW box - any suggestions? Some use the Focusrite Voicemaster Pro, which of course is more expensive than this but might do it...I am about to start a large audiobook job and wanted to have a more solid chain as sometimes the UA-30 USB box would skipip from time to time... Thanks again for the insight... CM |