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#1
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Are CD-R labels safe to put on masters?
Just wondering if placing an adhesive label on high quality CD media (HHB,
etc) could somehow present problems to a duplication facility... I guess issues could be the added weight of the label itself. Very little ink is used on the label, only the basic documentation. The labels are also centered properly with one of those handheld devices. Thanks! Roach |
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#2
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I recomend not putting them on master or any CDs.You can buy thermal CD
printers for around 100 to 200 dollars that will give it a great look and not harm the data. Stick on lables are a bad idea and a really bad idea for master copies as over time they can creat problems and even help destroy data.Some lables have harsh chemicals thatover time can hurt the CD. Mike Rocha wrote in message ... Just wondering if placing an adhesive label on high quality CD media (HHB, etc) could somehow present problems to a duplication facility... I guess issues could be the added weight of the label itself. Very little ink is used on the label, only the basic documentation. The labels are also centered properly with one of those handheld devices. Thanks! Roach |
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#3
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When I first got my CD-writer I used to put labels on some of them. Within
a year, none of the disks with labels were playable, all the disks I'm still using without labels are playable about 7 years later. Never put labels on disks. You have been warned. Rollasoc http://www.hairthieves.com "Troy" wrote in message news:wsWod.311790$Pl.188115@pd7tw1no... I recomend not putting them on master or any CDs.You can buy thermal CD printers for around 100 to 200 dollars that will give it a great look and not harm the data. Stick on lables are a bad idea and a really bad idea for master copies as over time they can creat problems and even help destroy data.Some lables have harsh chemicals thatover time can hurt the CD. Mike Rocha wrote in message ... Just wondering if placing an adhesive label on high quality CD media (HHB, etc) could somehow present problems to a duplication facility... I guess issues could be the added weight of the label itself. Very little ink is used on the label, only the basic documentation. The labels are also centered properly with one of those handheld devices. Thanks! Roach |
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#4
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Although inkjet CDs are better than lables,I woulden't use them for masters
either.Over time you can have problems with them also.Stick to thermal printing or a marker.Stay away from ink on masters all together.Its fine on copies of the master but just leave the master alone.Inkjet CDs can absorb moisture over time and get all mushy al start to fall apart.There are reports of this.Thermal printing is 100% safe...so thermal or nothing!!!!!.....and use good media with proper storage and you will have no problems. Chel van Gennip wrote in message ... On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 08:09:16 +0100, Troy wrote: Mike Rocha wrote in message ... Just wondering if placing an adhesive label on high quality CD media (HHB, etc) could somehow present problems to a duplication facility... I guess issues could be the added weight of the label itself. Very little ink is used on the label, only the basic documentation. The labels are also centered properly with one of those handheld devices. I recomend not putting them on master or any CDs.You can buy thermal CD printers for around 100 to 200 dollars that will give it a great look and not harm the data. Stick on lables are a bad idea and a really bad idea for master copies as over time they can creat problems and even help destroy data.Some lables have harsh chemicals thatover time can hurt the CD. I recomend inkjet printable CD's with an also cheap inkjet printer. I use a Canaon i865 with Taiyo Yuden Tuff-Coat Inkjet White printable CD-R(PRI53315-80P). The coating gives an extra protection for the data layer. With the printer you can put not only basic information but quite a lot of information on the disk, including high resolution images. The copyright notice goes perfect in a 6pt font. Adhesive labels can hurt the data layer and introduce unbalace. -- Chel van Gennip Visit Serg van Gennip's site http://www.serg.vangennip.com |
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#5
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Chel van Gennip wrote:
I recomend inkjet printable CD's with an also cheap inkjet printer. I use a Canaon i865 with Taiyo Yuden Tuff-Coat Inkjet White printable CD-R(PRI53315-80P). The coating gives an extra protection for the data layer. With the printer you can put not only basic information but quite a lot of information on the disk, including high resolution images. The copyright notice goes perfect in a 6pt font. Do these use the same water soluble inks as ink jet printing on paper? |
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#6
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No...It is more like a wax melted onto the CD and won't harm the CD in any
way and is very durable.It is also water proof and instantly dry once printed.We use rimage everest and prism thermal CD printers.They are very expensive but there are small consumer models for home use made by a few companies.The new one from Primera looks pretty cool and will print on 4 places on the CD. agent86 wrote in message .. . Chel van Gennip wrote: I recomend inkjet printable CD's with an also cheap inkjet printer. I use a Canaon i865 with Taiyo Yuden Tuff-Coat Inkjet White printable CD-R(PRI53315-80P). The coating gives an extra protection for the data layer. With the printer you can put not only basic information but quite a lot of information on the disk, including high resolution images. The copyright notice goes perfect in a 6pt font. Do these use the same water soluble inks as ink jet printing on paper? |
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#7
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Chel van Gennip wrote:
I recomend inkjet printable CD's with an also cheap inkjet printer. I use a Canaon i865 with Taiyo Yuden Tuff-Coat Inkjet White printable CD-R(PRI53315-80P). The coating gives an extra protection for the data layer. With the printer you can put not only basic information but quite a lot of information on the disk, including high resolution images. The copyright notice goes perfect in a 6pt font. agent86 wrote... Do these use the same water soluble inks as ink jet printing on paper? "Troy" wrote ... No...It is more like a wax melted onto the CD and won't harm the CD in any way and is very durable.It is also water proof and instantly dry once printed.We use rimage everest and prism thermal CD printers.They are very expensive but there are small consumer models for home use made by a few companies.The new one from Primera looks pretty cool and will print on 4 places on the CD. It appears that Agent86 was asking about the inkjet method described by Chel, but Troy was answering a different branch of the thread about thermal printing? As a user of an Epson Stylus Photo R300 inkjet printer, the answer to Agent86's question is, yes, it uses the same water- soluble ink as for printing on paper. I am interested in also getting a thermal printer and would like to hear which models people like (or dislike), and particularly about supplies of the printing foil rolls. |
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#8
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"Mike Rocha" wrote in message ... Just wondering if placing an adhesive label on high quality CD media (HHB, etc) could somehow present problems to a duplication facility... I guess issues could be the added weight of the label itself. Very little ink is used on the label, only the basic documentation. The labels are also centered properly with one of those handheld devices. Get this: www.lightscribe.com Glenn D. |
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#9
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I recomend inkjet printable CD's with an also cheap inkjet printer. I use a Canaon i865 with Taiyo Yuden Tuff-Coat Inkjet White printable CD-R(PRI53315-80P). The coating gives an extra protection for the data layer. With the printer you can put not only basic information but quite a lot of information on the disk, including high resolution images. The copyright notice goes perfect in a 6pt font. Do these use the same water soluble inks as ink jet printing on paper? Yes. You need special ink jet printable discs Richard H. Kuschel "I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty |
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#10
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Thats kind of neat but you need special LightScribe-enabled discs.I can see
these being a lot more expensive than non branded thermal printable CDs.But it is a very cool idea for home one offs.I would like to see one in action. Glenn Dowdy wrote in message ... "Mike Rocha" wrote in message ... Just wondering if placing an adhesive label on high quality CD media (HHB, etc) could somehow present problems to a duplication facility... I guess issues could be the added weight of the label itself. Very little ink is used on the label, only the basic documentation. The labels are also centered properly with one of those handheld devices. Get this: www.lightscribe.com Glenn D. |
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#12
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"Troy" wrote ...
Thats kind of neat but you need special LightScribe-enabled discs. And don't forget special drives with an additional blaster LED also. I can see these being a lot more expensive than non branded thermal printable CDs. But it is a very cool idea for home one offs. I would like to see one in action. It is a cool idea, but too little, too expensive, too late, I fear. |
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#13
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Richard Crowley wrote:
It appears that Agent86 was asking about the inkjet method described by Chel, but Troy was answering a different branch of the thread about thermal printing? As a user of an Epson Stylus Photo R300 inkjet printer, the answer to Agent86's question is, yes, it uses the same water- soluble ink as for printing on paper. I am interested in also getting a thermal printer and would like to hear which models people like (or dislike), and particularly about supplies of the printing foil rolls. Exactly. I find inkjets mostly worthless for much of anything because the inks are not waterproof when dry (plus, the ink cartriges are just so damn expensive, compared to laser toner). I'm still waiting for color lasers to come down in price (for paper), but the thermal printers sound like they have potential for CD-Rs. |
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#14
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Chel van Gennip wrote:
For archiving I think storage in a digital data format is more reliable than a digital audio format. Probably. Furthermore DVD+R seems more reliable than CD-R, because the datalayer is between polycarbonate disks. They promise expected lifetimes 100 years under normal conditions, Well, that remains to be seen. Of course, nobody reading this has a good reason to care if they last 100 years. What I'd worry about is whether the people making that promise were even trustworthy in general. There is some anectdotal evidence that even pressed CDs might not be as durable as we were initally promised they would be. although I think you will have to copy to a new format during this time because all formats will become obsolete in time. And, unfortunately, newer formats become obsolete MUCH faster than older ones, simply because no manufacturer WANTS to build a really good CD-R or DVD-R drive. A hundred years from now, there will STILL be Ampex & Studer tape machines in service. Whether there will be any usable tapes might be a different question altogether.) So for archiving I use WAV files on DVD. With the extra space you can archive the printwork on the same DVD. Masters for CD production can be created from this archive DVD. That's using the old noggin. Might still be wise to store at least two copies in separate locations & check them every couple of years. |
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#15
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"Richard Crowley" wrote in message ... "Troy" wrote ... Thats kind of neat but you need special LightScribe-enabled discs. And don't forget special drives with an additional blaster LED also. The LightScribe enabled drives use the same laser that's used to write the data side with. I can see these being a lot more expensive than non branded thermal printable CDs. But it is a very cool idea for home one offs. I would like to see one in action. It is a cool idea, but too little, too expensive, too late, I fear. Media won't be that much more expensive than standard CD-Rs, and they'll have a much better resolution. Glenn D. |
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#16
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"Mike Rivers" wrote in message news:znr1101318097k@trad... In article writes: www.lightscribe.com Are disks, drives, and software actually available yet? And at what cost? I think not. An interesting concept, but well apart from the question asked. You'll see'em soon. I've got mine, but I'm on the project team  Anyone can shoot links, but unless the product is available it doesn't solve a problem. And until the cost of "Lightscribale" media is comprable to a disk plus a label, it will just be a cool yuppie toy (for which we can be thankful, because that's what makes the cost drop). Media pricing will be comparable to disc plus label. Additionally, it solves the DVD+R labeling problems. Drives will also be competitive with non-LightScribe drives. Glenn D. |
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#17
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Chel van Gennip wrote:
A hundred years from now, there will STILL be Ampex & Studer tape machines in service. Whether there will be any usable tapes might be a different question altogether.) I doubt both the availability of the machines and the readability of the tapes in 20 years. Mainstream solutions like CD and DVD tend to last a bit longer. I have no doubt that quality tape recorders built 50 years ago will still be functional 100 years hence. At the time these things were built, there was no reason to believe that analog tape would not ALWAYS be the professional standard. If you don't expect the standard media to change, part of what makes it "Professional" is durability. That's just the way things were done back then. Planned obsolescence is a relatively modern concept. Conversely, there was usually no anticipation that some of the music created in the 60s & early 70s would be as timeless & influential as it has turned out to be. Before the Beatles came along, popular music was just that, "popular" Consequently, the original masters for a lot of classic recordings have already been lost. |
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#18
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I agree Richard ...."to little to late" ......thermal printing is the way to
go.Its cheap and durable. Richard Crowley wrote in message ... "Troy" wrote ... Thats kind of neat but you need special LightScribe-enabled discs. And don't forget special drives with an additional blaster LED also. I can see these being a lot more expensive than non branded thermal printable CDs. But it is a very cool idea for home one offs. I would like to see one in action. It is a cool idea, but too little, too expensive, too late, I fear. |
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#19
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Glen.....how long does it take to print a full coverage image?
Is there any way to get a print sample? I own a CD duplication business and we run 4 rimage proteges with prism printers and one automated Everest printer. How is the quality compaired to the prisms?.It looks kind of washed out in the pictures on the site. How would something like this stand up in 24hr production if it were packaged as an automated printer only?.Any idea of copies per life of the unit? I know this is a lot of questions but I am very interested in new printing technology. -- Thanks Troy Tremblay Glenn Dowdy wrote in message ... "Mike Rivers" wrote in message news:znr1101318097k@trad... In article writes: www.lightscribe.com Are disks, drives, and software actually available yet? And at what cost? I think not. An interesting concept, but well apart from the question asked. You'll see'em soon. I've got mine, but I'm on the project team Anyone can shoot links, but unless the product is available it doesn't solve a problem. And until the cost of "Lightscribale" media is comprable to a disk plus a label, it will just be a cool yuppie toy (for which we can be thankful, because that's what makes the cost drop). Media pricing will be comparable to disc plus label. Additionally, it solves the DVD+R labeling problems. Drives will also be competitive with non-LightScribe drives. Glenn D. |
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#20
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agent86 wrote:
Richard Crowley wrote: I recomend inkjet printable CD's with an also cheap inkjet printer. I use a Canon i865 with Taiyo Yuden Tuff-Coat Inkjet White printable CD-R(PRI53315-80P). The coating gives an extra protection for the data layer. With the printer you can put not only basic information but quite a lot of information on the disk, including high resolution images. Do these use the same water soluble inks as ink jet printing on paper? As a user of an Epson Stylus Photo R300 inkjet printer, the answer to Agent86's question is, yes, it uses the same water- soluble ink as for printing on paper. Exactly. I find inkjets mostly worthless for much of anything because the inks are not waterproof when dry Depends on the inkjet. Some of the higher end Epsons use pigment ink. http://www.epson.com.sg/innovations/InksUltraChrome.shtml http://www.pictureline.com/newsletter/2004/november/inkjetcolor.html The R800 ($399 list) can print on CDs. (plus, the ink cartriges are just so damn expensive, compared to laser toner). If you're just printing on CD's they don't cost all that much. For general purpose office needs, a laser is much less expensive to own. |
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#21
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Ink is still ink...unless you seal the top of the CD with a spray or CD
laminator (but they are expensive) Kurt Albershardt wrote in message ... agent86 wrote: Richard Crowley wrote: I recomend inkjet printable CD's with an also cheap inkjet printer. I use a Canon i865 with Taiyo Yuden Tuff-Coat Inkjet White printable CD-R(PRI53315-80P). The coating gives an extra protection for the data layer. With the printer you can put not only basic information but quite a lot of information on the disk, including high resolution images. Do these use the same water soluble inks as ink jet printing on paper? As a user of an Epson Stylus Photo R300 inkjet printer, the answer to Agent86's question is, yes, it uses the same water- soluble ink as for printing on paper. Exactly. I find inkjets mostly worthless for much of anything because the inks are not waterproof when dry Depends on the inkjet. Some of the higher end Epsons use pigment ink. http://www.epson.com.sg/innovations/InksUltraChrome.shtml http://www.pictureline.com/newsletter/2004/november/inkjetcolor.html The R800 ($399 list) can print on CDs. (plus, the ink cartriges are just so damn expensive, compared to laser toner). If you're just printing on CD's they don't cost all that much. For general purpose office needs, a laser is much less expensive to own. |
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#22
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"Richard Crowley" wrote ...
And don't forget special drives with an additional blaster LED also. "Glenn Dowdy" wrote ... The LightScribe enabled drives use the same laser that's used to write the data side with. http://www.lightscribe.com/howlightscribeworks.aspx "Your LightScribe-enabled CD/DVD disc drive contains a special laser that pumps light energy into a thin dye coating on the label side of the disc." |
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#23
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"Richard Crowley" wrote in message ... "Richard Crowley" wrote ... And don't forget special drives with an additional blaster LED also. "Glenn Dowdy" wrote ... The LightScribe enabled drives use the same laser that's used to write the data side with. http://www.lightscribe.com/howlightscribeworks.aspx "Your LightScribe-enabled CD/DVD disc drive contains a special laser that pumps light energy into a thin dye coating on the label side of the disc." Trust me. It's the same laser. It's been tuned a bit differently and the drive has special firmware, but there are only two lasers in the drive, same as any other DVD drive. Glenn D. |
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#24
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"Troy" wrote in message news:LBapd.321018$nl.173599@pd7tw3no... I agree Richard ...."to little to late" ......thermal printing is the way to go.Its cheap and durable. How does thermal work on DVDRs? Glenn D. |
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#25
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Troy wrote:
Ink is still ink...unless you seal the top of the CD with a spray or CD laminator (but they are expensive) So, what process is used to print the top of (major label) pressed CDs? |
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#26
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"Glenn Dowdy" wrote in message ... "Troy" wrote in message news:LBapd.321018$nl.173599@pd7tw3no... I agree Richard ...."to little to late" ......thermal printing is the way to go.Its cheap and durable. How does thermal work on DVDRs? Why would it be any different than on CDRs? |
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#27
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"agent86" wrote ...
So, what process is used to print the top of (major label) pressed CDs? Screen printing (aka "silk-screen") with ink/paint optimized for printing on optical disks. Same method used to print on T-shirts, equipment panels, and a wide variety of industrial and consumer products. |
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#28
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"Glenn Dowdy" wrote ...
"Richard Crowley" wrote ... "Richard Crowley" wrote ... And don't forget special drives with an additional blaster LED also. "Glenn Dowdy" wrote ... The LightScribe enabled drives use the same laser that's used to write the data side with. http://www.lightscribe.com/howlightscribeworks.aspx "Your LightScribe-enabled CD/DVD disc drive contains a special laser that pumps light energy into a thin dye coating on the label side of the disc." Trust me. It's the same laser. It's been tuned a bit differently and the drive has special firmware, but there are only two lasers in the drive, same as any other DVD drive. But still requires a special drive and special disks. Even if HP could get all drive makers to incorporate the firmware, the discs would likely still cost more because of the extra processing required and likely lower volume. But I would love to be shown wrong as it is an elegant idea. |
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#29
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They use different types of inks such as plastic inks and UV inks.It is a
different process.Usually done by silkscreen or offset press. agent86 wrote in message ... Troy wrote: Ink is still ink...unless you seal the top of the CD with a spray or CD laminator (but they are expensive) So, what process is used to print the top of (major label) pressed CDs? |
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#30
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I prefer printing on thermal white top DVDRs.Usually when printing DVDRs we
use the Everest printer that prints right to the center hole.It looks better than silkscreening on pressed DVDs.It has magazine quality. Glenn Dowdy wrote in message ... "Troy" wrote in message news:LBapd.321018$nl.173599@pd7tw3no... I agree Richard ...."to little to late" ......thermal printing is the way to go.Its cheap and durable. How does thermal work on DVDRs? Glenn D. |
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#31
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It actually is a little different printing on a DVDR compaired to a CDR.When
you print just black thermal on a silver top DVDR it looks a little strange,kind of like printing black on a mirror,at least it has been with the DVDRs I have used.We prefer to use thermal white top DVDRs and print them full color on top.Black also looks great on the white background. Richard Crowley wrote in message ... "Glenn Dowdy" wrote in message ... "Troy" wrote in message news:LBapd.321018$nl.173599@pd7tw3no... I agree Richard ...."to little to late" ......thermal printing is the way to go.Its cheap and durable. How does thermal work on DVDRs? Why would it be any different than on CDRs? |
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#32
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"Glenn Dowdy" wrote ...
How does thermal work on DVDRs? Troy" wrote ... It actually is a little different printing on a DVDR compaired to a CDR.When you print just black thermal on a silver top DVDR it looks a little strange,kind of like printing black on a mirror,at least it has been with the DVDRs I have used.We prefer to use thermal white top DVDRs and print them full color on top.Black also looks great on the white background. I guess I didn't understand the question OR the answer. Thermal printing on "silver" disks looks the same whether they are CDR or DVDR. Printing on white "printable" disks looks the same whether it is a CDR or DVDR disc. |
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#33
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#34
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#36
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Mike Rivers wrote: In article writes: I'm still waiting for color lasers to come down in price (for paper), but the thermal printers sound like they have potential for CD-Rs. A couple of years ago, Casio (I think) came out with a dedicated thermal printer for CDs that was pretty cheap, around $100 as I recall, but the "ink" ran about half a buck per disk for a pretty simple label (which was all it was capable of printing). I don't think I ever saw one outside a trade show, nor a later model. For about a year now, I've been threatening to get a Brother laser printer for paper as soon as I run out of ink for my current inkjet. But while the cost of the printer has come down to around $100 the toner is still up there. I picked up a laserjet 4si for 50 bucks at an auction a couple years ago. Haven't even bought a new toner cartridge for it yet, as the one that it came with was mostly full. You can find some great deals at auction houses, you can also find people with more money than brains. --Dale |
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#37
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#38
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"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
news:znr1101348070k@trad... In article writes: I'm still waiting for color lasers to come down in price (for paper), but the thermal printers sound like they have potential for CD-Rs. A couple of years ago, Casio (I think) came out with a dedicated thermal printer for CDs that was pretty cheap, around $100 as I recall, but the "ink" ran about half a buck per disk for a pretty simple label (which was all it was capable of printing). I don't think I ever saw one outside a trade show, nor a later model. For about a year now, I've been threatening to get a Brother laser printer for paper as soon as I run out of ink for my current inkjet. But while the cost of the printer has come down to around $100 the toner is still up there. Mike, I've been using a couple of Samsung laser printers (1st one @ $65, 2nd @ $120). I do at least two re-fills of the original toner cartridge. I'm on my fourth re-fill on one now, which works like new. Steve King |
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#39
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"Mike Rivers" wrote ...
If the laser arrangement is the same as a standard drive as Glenn says, I suppose that you burn the audio side of the disk, then turn it over and burn the label side. I'd guess that this takes longer than printing and sticking a paper label. People don't like stuff that makes them wait, particularly when they can't see what's happening. That's why we have 52X CD writers, and we still have impatient users. Not to mention that it is black&white only while you can print full color (photographic quality, even) with inkjet, whether on labels or directly on the disc. |
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#40
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Linear Mode
