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#1
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereo Bass Revisited
Some time ago, I stated that there was no such thing as stereo bass, a
notion that I beleive is still somewhat debateable, depending on who you ask. I found this thread fro RAO of all places with participation from some very knowledgable people, Arny, Tom and B.J. Feng and to a lesser degree, Howard Ferstler, who appears to be getting spanked pretty hard here. According to Dr. Feng and apparently JJ (who is referenced in the conversation) stereo bass is a real thing for home audio. Therefore I feel it neccessary to revise my position and just for kicks ask if this issue is in fact resovled, or is it still debated? True that the majority of recordings, particularly those for LP had bass response summed to mon, but we have advance to CD now and things that weren't possible for LP are now possible with CD. Do most current recordings have bass response summed to mono, or are there more recordings available with stereo bass. The thread with the discussion I mentioned earlier is located at: http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...J.+Feng&hl=en& |
#2
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereo Bass Revisited
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#3
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereo Bass Revisited
Do most current recordings have bass response summed to mono, or are
there more recordings available with stereo bass. Question: If there were, would it make a difference under most end-user conditions? It would seem that this is something so easily tested by almost anyone as to be not very good fodder for debate. I am looking for help he Typically ~500hz is taken as the threshold for directional bass. Most of us have test discs of various natures with tones well below this threshold. Mine goes to 15hz. Mine also has right, left, and both tracks. It would seem pretty simple to pick a frequency well within the flat region of your speaker response, say.... 30hz or so (even 80hz if one does not have full-range speakers), and go through those steps. If you can discern which speaker is playing _every_ time with your back turned to them, then Stereo bass exists. If not, then it is a subject for speculation on large stages, but within your typical listening area, not. Anyone done this? is this a valid test? Bats use high audio frequencies for echo-location as air is a light-density medium, and distances are relatively short. Submarines use much lower frequencies, but still well 'up there' as water is a medium density medium, and distances are considerably longer. Oil-field echo-location uses VERY low frequencies as earth and stone are very dense media and distances are long indeed. So, on a very large stage, I can see bass frequencies giving critical spatial information. I am not convinced that it would do so in the average room in the average house. One more bit: Thunder at some distance propagates at very low frequencies. Can you pick its direction just from the sound? Think about it. Peter Wieck Wyncote, PA |
#4
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Stereo Bass Revisited
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#5
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereo Bass Revisited
so I thought it worthwhile to have some input from some pretty smart guys one of which doesn't post to
usent AFAIK anymore. Couple of things: "two separate subwoofers" = perhaps two full-range speakers.... Ancient technology, that would be! But the common practice until 'boutique' speakers designed more for looks than function came into vogue. And users with flea-powered amps driving 'full-range single-driver' speakers won't make it anyway. For that group, the subwoofer is a necessity as well as being a tacit admission that full-range speakers are not. To that end, just the other day, I visited a gentleman oh-so-proud of his VERY expensive full-range speakers (Lowther drivers??). Only they came with separate super-tweeters and a fairly massive subwoofer. Oh well! I was pleasant and bit my tongue. Based on this set-up, he could not test your concept. The point would seem that if individuals were to invest in actual, genuine, legitimate full-range speakers and sufficient power to drive them, it would be quite easy to test your concept with a $10 test CD right in their own home. Writing entirely for myself, I do have such speakers (several sets) _and_ the power to drive them. So whether or not stereo bass exists is moot. If it's there, my speakers will reproduce it. If it is mixed down to mono, they will reproduce that as well. When I get a chance at it (likely not before the weekend), I will test the concept myself just for giggles on two different systems, one SS (225wpc/rms) and one tube (75wpc/rms) and see what happens. But you do raise interesting points. Easy to test under the correct conditions, but nonetheless interesting. Peter Wieck Wyncote, PA |
#6
Posted to rec.audio.high-end
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Stereo Bass Revisited
wrote in message
... Some time ago, I stated that there was no such thing as stereo bass, a notion that I beleive is still somewhat debateable, depending on who you ask. I found this thread fro RAO of all places with participation from some very knowledgable people, Arny, Tom and B.J. Feng and to a lesser degree, Howard Ferstler, who appears to be getting spanked pretty hard here. According to Dr. Feng and apparently JJ (who is referenced in the conversation) stereo bass is a real thing for home audio. Therefore I feel it neccessary to revise my position and just for kicks ask if this issue is in fact resovled, or is it still debated? True that the majority of recordings, particularly those for LP had bass response summed to mon, but we have advance to CD now and things that weren't possible for LP are now possible with CD. Do most current recordings have bass response summed to mono, or are there more recordings available with stereo bass. The thread with the discussion I mentioned earlier is located at: http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...J.+Feng&hl=en& I have a pipe organ recording which was apparently made using omnidirectional mikes spaced widely. Since pipe organs often have their lowest pipes "in prospect", they are divided between the right and left sides of the organ, alternating sides each half-step. The result is that C is on the left side and C# is on the right side, D on the left, D# on the right, etc. etc. Indeed, the signal is much stronger in one side than the other. You can't hear which side the sound is coming from, since your ears are too close together to provide directional cues, but that doesn't change the fact that the signal is--from the standpoint of the electronics--unequal. Since low frequency performance is the major factor influencing the price of a speaker, it pays to sum these signals into one reproducer. It's analogous to a reversible freeway lane that switches direction at noon, so the lane is always open to rush hour traffic. Saves real estate and money. Norm Strong |
#7
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Stereo Bass Revisited
wrote in message ...
Do most current recordings have bass response summed to mono, or are there more recordings available with stereo bass. The easy way to find out is to disconnect your speakers and put one of them across the two "hot" terminals of left and right. If there's no deep bass, then the bass has been summed to mono. (IIRC this can be hazardous with some valve amplifiers, where you may blow up the output transformers.) Patrick Wallace __________________________________________________ __________________________ -- NewsGuy.Com 30Gb $9.95 Carry Forward and On Demand Bandwidth |
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