[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
Scott Dorsey wrote:
In article , Trevor wrote:
On 5/06/2015 2:08 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
The rosin fumes don't contain any lead,

The fumes DO contain some vaporised lead particles. Whether it is
enough to cause harm is another question, and obviously depends on
length of exposure etc.

If that's the case, how can I leave the solder molten in a solder pot
for weeks on end without the lead/tin mixture changing at all? You
can't do that with brass. Same goes for wave-soldering tanks. --scott

Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.

Of course it probably depends on what else is in the water.

--
*If your feet smell and your nose runs, you're built upside down.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[geoff]

On 7/06/2015 4:32 a.m., Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Scott Dorsey wrote:
In article , Trevor wrote:
On 5/06/2015 2:08 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
The rosin fumes don't contain any lead,

The fumes DO contain some vaporised lead particles. Whether it is
enough to cause harm is another question, and obviously depends on
length of exposure etc.

If that's the case, how can I leave the solder molten in a solder pot
for weeks on end without the lead/tin mixture changing at all? You
can't do that with brass. Same goes for wave-soldering tanks. --scott

Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.


One theory is that it appeared alter the Romans pretty effectively.

Might explain some things in present days too ...

geoff

[Les Cargill[_4_]]

geoff wrote:
On 7/06/2015 4:32 a.m., Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Scott Dorsey wrote:
In article , Trevor
wrote:
On 5/06/2015 2:08 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
The rosin fumes don't contain any lead,

The fumes DO contain some vaporised lead particles. Whether it is
enough to cause harm is another question, and obviously depends on
length of exposure etc.

If that's the case, how can I leave the solder molten in a solder pot
for weeks on end without the lead/tin mixture changing at all? You
can't do that with brass. Same goes for wave-soldering tanks. --scott

Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at
one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.


One theory is that it appeared alter the Romans pretty effectively.

Might explain some things in present days too ...

geoff



I'd think it would have explained past things better - dLead/dt is
decidedly negative these days.

"For six hundred years we taught you to control your impulses with
reason, then in 1910 we stepped back. Within fifty years, you'd brought
us World War I, the Depression, Fascism, the Holocaust and capped it
off by bringing the entire planet to the brink of destruction in the
Cuban Missile Crisis." - Thompson, "The Adjustment Bureau."

Fun, deftly balanced movie. Probably a bit lightweight but I don't
blame them for that.

--
Les Cargill

[Don Pearce[_3_]]

On Sun, 07 Jun 2015 11:27:31 +1200, geoff
wrote:

On 7/06/2015 4:32 a.m., Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Scott Dorsey wrote:
In article , Trevor wrote:
On 5/06/2015 2:08 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
The rosin fumes don't contain any lead,

The fumes DO contain some vaporised lead particles. Whether it is
enough to cause harm is another question, and obviously depends on
length of exposure etc.

If that's the case, how can I leave the solder molten in a solder pot
for weeks on end without the lead/tin mixture changing at all? You
can't do that with brass. Same goes for wave-soldering tanks. --scott

Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.


One theory is that it appeared alter the Romans pretty effectively.

Might explain some things in present days too ...

geoff

I've read a couple of studies that show at least a correlation between
lead in petrol and violence in young people. I don't know if any of
them established a causal link - not sure how you would even go about
doing that...

d

[geoff]

On 7/06/2015 7:49 p.m., Don Pearce wrote:


I've read a couple of studies that show at least a correlation between
lead in petrol and violence in young people. I don't know if any of
them established a causal link - not sure how you would even go about
doing that...

d



I heard somewhere that many cities in the USA still have lead water
mains. But that could be urban legend ....

And back on-topic, solder-fume extractor fans with activated-charcoal
based filters can be had reasonably cheaply these days.

geoff

[Don Pearce[_3_]]

On Sun, 07 Jun 2015 20:42:40 +1200, geoff
wrote:

On 7/06/2015 7:49 p.m., Don Pearce wrote:


I've read a couple of studies that show at least a correlation between
lead in petrol and violence in young people. I don't know if any of
them established a causal link - not sure how you would even go about
doing that...

d



I heard somewhere that many cities in the USA still have lead water
mains. But that could be urban legend ....

And back on-topic, solder-fume extractor fans with activated-charcoal
based filters can be had reasonably cheaply these days.

geoff

I think lead water pipes are pretty much harmless provided they are
not disturbed. They rapidly grow a coating on the lead that prevents
further chemical reaction.

d

[Scott Dorsey]

geoff wrote:
On 7/06/2015 7:49 p.m., Don Pearce wrote:

I've read a couple of studies that show at least a correlation between
lead in petrol and violence in young people. I don't know if any of
them established a causal link - not sure how you would even go about
doing that...

Yes. Apparently leaded gasoline was the major source for lead contamination.
Then they replaced lead with MBTE which poisoned the groundwater. Go figure.
Now we have ethanol as an anti-knock ingredient.

I heard somewhere that many cities in the USA still have lead water
mains. But that could be urban legend ....

Yes, but the lead water main is fine if the water is hard; it develops a
thin crust of minerals that protects the water from the lead. This means
that cities like Washington that still have extensive lead mains have to
be very careful about mineral content and pH.

There are some cities that still have _wood_ water mains in the US.

And back on-topic, solder-fume extractor fans with activated-charcoal
based filters can be had reasonably cheaply these days.

It's a good idea if you don't want to gunk your lungs up with rosin, and
it's required by OSHA in production environments for that reason.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[[email protected]]

https://www.organicconsumers.org/old...lead081004.php


Does any of that apply to the lead in the soldered parts of electronics?

I don't think so. If a ventilation system is used while soldering then
exposure to workers will be minimized.


Could reduction of exposure to the Evil Five(aluminum, arsenic,
cadmium, lead, & mercury) reduce violent & criminal behavior,
as well as irrational thinking leading to same? I'm a believer!

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
geoff wrote:
Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.


One theory is that it appeared alter the Romans pretty effectively.

But they made drinking vessels out of it. And obviously, things we drink
other than water might well dissolve the lead. Wine, for example.

--
*If God had wanted me to touch my toes, he would have put them on my knees

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article ,
Don Pearce wrote:
Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.


One theory is that it appeared alter the Romans pretty effectively.

Might explain some things in present days too ...

geoff

I've read a couple of studies that show at least a correlation between
lead in petrol and violence in young people. I don't know if any of
them established a causal link - not sure how you would even go about
doing that...

Well yes. Lead in petrol burns and produces a compound which can be
breathed in. But the temperature needed for that is far higher than used
for soldering.

--
*There are two kinds of pedestrians... the quick and the dead.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[Trevor]

On 7/06/2015 2:32 AM, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Scott Dorsey wrote:
In article , Trevor wrote:
On 5/06/2015 2:08 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
The rosin fumes don't contain any lead,

The fumes DO contain some vaporised lead particles. Whether it is
enough to cause harm is another question, and obviously depends on
length of exposure etc.

If that's the case, how can I leave the solder molten in a solder pot
for weeks on end without the lead/tin mixture changing at all? You
can't do that with brass. Same goes for wave-soldering tanks. --scott

Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.

Give it long enough and it will "dissolve" in water. You wouldn't live
long enough to see the effect though. Just as a wave soldering tank
certainly wont evaporate overnight! So the real question I certainly
can't answer, is it enough to be dangerous to you.

Trevor.

[Trevor]

On 7/06/2015 6:42 PM, geoff wrote:
And back on-topic, solder-fume extractor fans with activated-charcoal
based filters can be had reasonably cheaply these days.

Right, and there is a reason for their ready availabilty these days,
when no one used them once upon a time.

Trevor.

[Trevor]

On 8/06/2015 12:10 AM, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
geoff wrote:
Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.


One theory is that it appeared alter the Romans pretty effectively.

But they made drinking vessels out of it. And obviously, things we drink
other than water might well dissolve the lead. Wine, for example.

Right, many people even avoid lead crystal glasses these days.

Trevor.

[Trevor]

On 7/06/2015 12:54 AM, Roy W. Rising wrote:
Trevor wrote:
On 5/06/2015 8:57 AM, Les Cargill wrote:
Leaded solder? I stocked up when there was a threat of its banishment.

You can still buy it.


We know that now, we did not know that for sure back then!

Fair enough, just as some people here stocked up on incandecent globes
when they were banned here. Turns out you can still get them anyway, but
they are dearer now because of low volume.

Trevor.

[Les Cargill[_4_]]

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
geoff wrote:
Quite. Rather like lead water pipes - which were the norm in the UK at one
point. If the lead dissolved in water, you'd expect to see signs of
erosion over the many years of use.


One theory is that it appeared alter the Romans pretty effectively.

But they made drinking vessels out of it. And obviously, things we drink
other than water might well dissolve the lead. Wine, for example.



One version of the Romans used lead salts as sweeteners. SFAIK,
that's the thing people talk about when they speculate about lead
poisoning among the Romans.

--
Les Cargill

[Scott Dorsey]

Les Cargill wrote:

One version of the Romans used lead salts as sweeteners. SFAIK,
that's the thing people talk about when they speculate about lead
poisoning among the Romans.

Not just the Romans. The Escoffier cookbook from 1906 still has some
pastry recipes with sugar of lead.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[geoff]

On 9/06/2015 1:08 a.m., Scott Dorsey wrote:
Les Cargill wrote:

One version of the Romans used lead salts as sweeteners. SFAIK,
that's the thing people talk about when they speculate about lead
poisoning among the Romans.

Not just the Romans. The Escoffier cookbook from 1906 still has some
pastry recipes with sugar of lead.
--scott



Is that where the word "scoff", wrt eating, arose ?

geoff

[JackA]

On Monday, June 8, 2015 at 2:41:10 AM UTC-4, Trevor wrote:
On 7/06/2015 12:54 AM, Roy W. Rising wrote:
Trevor wrote:
On 5/06/2015 8:57 AM, Les Cargill wrote:
Leaded solder? I stocked up when there was a threat of its banishment.

[JackA]

On Sunday, June 7, 2015 at 8:50:59 AM UTC-4, wrote:
https://www.organicconsumers.org/old...lead081004.php


Does any of that apply to the lead in the soldered parts of electronics?

I don't think so. If a ventilation system is used while soldering then
exposure to workers will be minimized.


Could reduction of exposure to the Evil Five(aluminum, arsenic,
cadmium, lead, & mercury) reduce violent & criminal behavior,
as well as irrational thinking leading to same? I'm a believer!

Not sure I'd believe lead is the cause of crime. Because I don't know anyone that became violent. I do believe you THINK crime is on the rise, because you are better informed via internet, iPhone, TV, whatever.

BUT, I do believe a lot of "hobbies" are gone and people tend to create their very own entertainment. Let's say they prohibit alcohol, remove TV, radio, movies, even ban books, all entertainment. I do not think you'd want to exist in that kind of environment.

Jack

[jason]

On 8 Jun 2015 09:08:09 -0400 "Scott Dorsey" wrote in
article
Not just the Romans.


Is it myth or truth that Beethoven suffered from Pb poisoning that may
have accounted for his hearing loss.

[Trevor]

On 9/06/2015 12:11 PM, Jason wrote:
Is it myth or truth that Beethoven suffered from Pb poisoning that may
have accounted for his hearing loss.

AFAIK Beethoven suffered from otosclerosis, just as tens of thousands of
people do today. The difference of course is we now have surgery and
hearing aids to help address the problem.

Trevor.