I'm trying to understand something that Gerald Weber said in the
October '05 issue of Vintage Guitar in response to someone's question
as to the function of the choke in a power supply pi filter.

He said,"... A choke resists changes in current, so to some degree, it
suppresses the output-stage dynamics. ..."

The Fender Princeton 5E2 is a single ended circuit. It seems to me that
any changing current through the tube will result in a changing voltage
at the primary of the output transformer and hence across it to the
secondary and on the load if the pwer supply fed an ideal constant
current into the primary of the output transformer. I don't understand
how it "suppresses the output-stage dynamics."

Best regards,
Joe

Sorry for the typo. The the last part of the next to last sentence
should read:

.... and on the load even if the power supply fed an ideal constant
current into the primary of the output transformer.

Joseph Meditz wrote:

I'm trying to understand something that Gerald Weber said in the
October '05 issue of Vintage Guitar in response to someone's question
as to the function of the choke in a power supply pi filter.

He said,"... A choke resists changes in current, so to some degree, it
suppresses the output-stage dynamics. ..."

The Fender Princeton 5E2 is a single ended circuit. It seems to me that
any changing current through the tube will result in a changing voltage
at the primary of the output transformer and hence across it to the
secondary and on the load if the pwer supply fed an ideal constant
current into the primary of the output transformer. I don't understand
how it "suppresses the output-stage dynamics."

Best regards,
Joe

Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.

Here are a couple of very good references.

http://www.thetubestore.com/earfenam.html
Written by Eric Barbour

http://www.harmony-central.com/Guita...inceton-1.html

Cheers, John Stewart

I don't know the Fender power supply circuit offhand. But if it has a
choke-input supply, removing the choke would cause a drastic rise in the B+
voltage. This could do many Bad Things - blown caps, melted tubes (depending
on the operating point they end up at with a different plate voltage). Don't
do it unless you know what you are doing.

Just in case, please be aware that the voltages inside even a small tube amp
are more than adequate to kill you. It can be extremely dangerous even when
the amp is off and unplugged.


"John Stewart" wrote in message
...
Joseph Meditz wrote:

I'm trying to understand something that Gerald Weber said in the
October '05 issue of Vintage Guitar in response to someone's question
as to the function of the choke in a power supply pi filter.

He said,"... A choke resists changes in current, so to some degree, it
suppresses the output-stage dynamics. ..."

The Fender Princeton 5E2 is a single ended circuit. It seems to me that
any changing current through the tube will result in a changing voltage
at the primary of the output transformer and hence across it to the
secondary and on the load if the pwer supply fed an ideal constant
current into the primary of the output transformer. I don't understand
how it "suppresses the output-stage dynamics."

Best regards,
Joe

Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.

Here are a couple of very good references.

http://www.thetubestore.com/earfenam.html
Written by Eric Barbour

http://www.harmony-central.com/Guita...inceton-1.html

Cheers, John Stewart

Joseph Meditz wrote:

I'm trying to understand something that Gerald Weber said in the
October '05 issue of Vintage Guitar in response to someone's question
as to the function of the choke in a power supply pi filter.

He said,"... A choke resists changes in current, so to some degree, it
suppresses the output-stage dynamics. ..."

The purpose of the choke is to filter the hum from the PS that would occur
if there was no choke in a CLC pi filter.
This sort of filter in the old days consisted typically
of 16uF, 5H, 16uF.

Your circuit is a single ended class A1 circuit, and unless the output is
clipping due to gross over drive, there is no suppression of the dynamics
in the output stage
at all due to the choke because the SE tube draws a constant current right
up to clipping,
apart from a small variation due to the second harmonic distortion of the
tube.

Leave the choke right where it is unless you want to upgrade the PS.
In this case the only thing that you can do is replace the C2 with say 100
uF/450V
but leave the C1 and choke in the circuit as is.
C1 should not be raised in value lest you cause the rectifier 5Y3 to
become overloaded by the peak charging currents which will cause it to die.



The Fender Princeton 5E2 is a single ended circuit. It seems to me that
any changing current through the tube will result in a changing voltage
at the primary of the output transformer and hence across it to the
secondary and on the load if the pwer supply fed an ideal constant
current into the primary of the output transformer. I don't understand
how it "suppresses the output-stage dynamics."

As far as the tube plus OPT and the load it has is concerned,
the C2 of the CLC filter acts as a low impedance at signal F.

If the dynamic Ra of 6V6 is 40kohms, and load = 8k, then total dynamic load
=
say 48k.
If C2 = 16 uF, then its impedance = 100 ohms at 100Hz, and such an
impedance is low
compared to the load connected to it.
So if there is 4 watts of power in the 8k load, the signal voltage at the
6V6 anode is 178vrms, and I = 0.022A, so the voltage at the C2 due to
signal
at 100Hz = 0.022 x 100 ohms = 2.25Vrms, which is tiny compared to
the signal voltage across the OPT.
At 1kHz, signal at the 16 uF = 0.22 Vrms at 4 watts.

There is no mechanism at work to cause compression or limiting
other than the natural voltage excursion limits.
If the anode signal voltage was 178Vrms, then this = 251Vpeak, and the Ea
would have to be
around +300V to allow this much voltage swing.
Beyond a swing of around 180vrms, the 6V6 will begin to clip.

In a class AB PP amp, the Ea of the tubes will reduce at full power from
the idle value
and so some reduction of the possible Vswing at the anode occurs.

Patrick Turner.




Best regards,
Joe

** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal (in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




.......... Phil

John Stewart wrote:

Joseph Meditz wrote:

I'm trying to understand something that Gerald Weber said in the
October '05 issue of Vintage Guitar in response to someone's question
as to the function of the choke in a power supply pi filter.

He said,"... A choke resists changes in current, so to some degree, it
suppresses the output-stage dynamics. ..."

The Fender Princeton 5E2 is a single ended circuit. It seems to me that
any changing current through the tube will result in a changing voltage
at the primary of the output transformer and hence across it to the
secondary and on the load if the pwer supply fed an ideal constant
current into the primary of the output transformer. I don't understand
how it "suppresses the output-stage dynamics."

Best regards,
Joe

Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.

Weber is an idiot.

He also recommends piling tons of capacitance onto
rectifier tubes.

LV

Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.

Gerald Weber did not say to remove the choke. What he said was that
the amp would sound better if you fed the screen from the output of the
pi section but fed the plate from the _input_ to the pi filter.
Increased ripple aside, his point was that this would give better
dynamic response.

Joe

Joseph Meditz wrote:

Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.

Gerald Weber did not say to remove the choke. What he said was that
the amp would sound better if you fed the screen from the output of the
pi section but fed the plate from the _input_ to the pi filter.
Increased ripple aside, his point was that this would give better
dynamic response.

Joe

That is an easy mod to try, anyway. In order to cut down the PS ripple you could
safely increase the incoming cap to 40 microfarad, the max spec'd for the 5Y3
rectifier. There is negative feedback already in the circuit, so that will
minimize any residual hum. I've built quite a few SE amps this way with good
results. That includes those with a 6V6 output.

BTW, you can read about my latest effort in the hifi amp realm in the September
issue of AudioXpress magazine. PP 6V6's. Very low distortion. And very low cost
to build at less than 200.00 USD. Take your pick of several versions. The amp is
shown both cathode & fixed bias while the PS is shown as traditional &
regulated. All with lots of measurement data while running in various modes. The
circuit used may surprise some here.

Good luck with your amp. John Stewart

John Stewart wrote:

Joseph Meditz wrote:

Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.

Gerald Weber did not say to remove the choke. What he said was that
the amp would sound better if you fed the screen from the output of the
pi section but fed the plate from the _input_ to the pi filter.
Increased ripple aside, his point was that this would give better
dynamic response.

Joe

That is an easy mod to try, anyway. In order to cut down the PS ripple you could
safely increase the incoming cap to 40 microfarad, the max spec'd for the 5Y3
rectifier. There is negative feedback already in the circuit, so that will
minimize any residual hum. I've built quite a few SE amps this way with good
results. That includes those with a 6V6 output.

BTW, you can read about my latest effort in the hifi amp realm in the September
issue of AudioXpress magazine. PP 6V6's. Very low distortion. And very low cost
to build at less than 200.00 USD. Take your pick of several versions. The amp is
shown both cathode & fixed bias while the PS is shown as traditional &
regulated. All with lots of measurement data while running in various modes. The
circuit used may surprise some here.

Good luck with your amp. John Stewart

I should have mentioned the fixed bias version of the new amp manages just under 15
watts at clipping. JLS

Forget the meds today, Phil?


"Phil Allison" wrote in message
...


** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal (in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is
merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even
consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in
audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




......... Phil

In article , wrote:

Joseph Meditz wrote:

Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.

Gerald Weber did not say to remove the choke. What he said was that
the amp would sound better if you fed the screen from the output of the
pi section but fed the plate from the _input_ to the pi filter.
Increased ripple aside, his point was that this would give better
dynamic response.

Joe

That is an easy mod to try, anyway. In order to cut down the PS ripple
you could
safely increase the incoming cap to 40 microfarad, the max spec'd for the 5Y3
rectifier. There is negative feedback already in the circuit, so that will
minimize any residual hum. I've built quite a few SE amps this way with good
results. That includes those with a 6V6 output.

Also negative feedback or not, because of the high impedance of the plate,
pentode amps don't need a well filtered plate supply to keep the hum down,
although the screen supply does need to be ripple free.


Regards,

John Byrns


Surf my web pages at, http://users.rcn.com/jbyrns/

Joseph Meditz wrote:
Removing the choke from the power supply of a Fender 5E2 will result in
lots of hum at the output. Not recommended at all.

Without seeing the rest of the article you have referenced it is difficult
to figure out what the author had in mind.


Gerald Weber did not say to remove the choke. What he said was that
the amp would sound better if you fed the screen from the output of the
pi section but fed the plate from the _input_ to the pi filter.
Increased ripple aside, his point was that this would give better
dynamic response.


Joe



That is an easy mod to try, anyway. In order to cut down the PS ripple you could
safely increase the incoming cap to 40 microfarad, the max spec'd for the 5Y3
rectifier. There is negative feedback already in the circuit, so that will
minimize any residual hum. I've built quite a few SE amps this way with good
results. That includes those with a 6V6 output.


Hi John,

Ripple is not the issue here. The question is whether doing this will
improve dynamic response. Can you think of any reason why it should?


BTW, you can read about my latest effort in the hifi amp realm in the September
issue of AudioXpress magazine. PP 6V6's. Very low distortion. And very low cost
to build at less than 200.00 USD. Take your pick of several versions. The amp is
shown both cathode & fixed bias while the PS is shown as traditional &
regulated. All with lots of measurement data while running in various modes. The
circuit used may surprise some here.

OK. I rarely read Audio Express but will pick up a copy for your
article. But I used to subscribe to Glass Audio before I ever messed
with a tube CKT but did not renew when they became Audio Express which,
IMO, is very poor substitute for Glass Audio.

Joe

Joseph Meditz wrote:
I'm trying to understand something that Gerald Weber said in the
October '05 issue of Vintage Guitar in response to someone's question
as to the function of the choke in a power supply pi filter.

He said,"... A choke resists changes in current, so to some degree, it
suppresses the output-stage dynamics. ..."




...
Your circuit is a single ended class A1 circuit, and unless the output is
clipping due to gross over drive, there is no suppression of the dynamics
in the output stage
at all due to the choke because the SE tube draws a constant current right
up to clipping,
apart from a small variation due to the second harmonic distortion of the
tube.

Hi Patrick,

OK. You disagree with Gerald Weber's statement.

Thanks,
Joe

Joseph Meditz wrote:

Hi John,

Ripple is not the issue here. The question is whether doing this will
improve dynamic response. Can you think of any reason why it should?

Sound to all of us is a very subjective thing. So I guess it depends a lot on who you
would ask in each case. The result will depend as much on the speaker in its box & the
listening area as it does on the amplifier! Best to try the circuit changes which are
fairly simple to make & then decide for yourself. Instrument amplifiers really are in
a different world than one would expect for hifi. A guitar amp is really a big part of
the overall affect you are trying to attain. If you were to look at the response of
the amp to a step function before & after the mods I doubt you would see any
improvement.

OK. I rarely read Audio Express but will pick up a copy for your
article. But I used to subscribe to Glass Audio before I ever messed
with a tube CKT but did not renew when they became Audio Express which,
IMO, is very poor substitute for Glass Audio.

Joe

It seems that the printed page is under attack, I think by the internet. I've been a
subscriber to Playboy more than 40 years, Scientific American about 30 years & they
are both much smaller than they once were. In my opinion Glass Audio was a better
magazine for anyone into tubes but the publisher has to do whatever is necessary to
stay in business! There are still quite a few interesting articles published in
AudioXpress covering vacuum tube circuits.

Cheers, John Stewart

"John Willoughby"


** FYI:

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal (in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




.......... Phil

On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 01:05:42 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:



** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal (in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




......... Phil



what started you off this time?

bill ramsay wrote:

On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 01:05:42 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:



** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal (in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




......... Phil



what started you off this time?

I doubt Phil could even begin to answer your question properly.

I'll try to be brief.

Phil appears to have suffered a mental breakdown.

It seems to have occured as a result of my refusal to examine
mosfet data with regard to a class A mosfet amp designed by a british female
by the name of Sue Parker.
( A google search, 'Sue Parker zeus amplifier' will bring up the links to her
informative site. )


I like this fine female. She has the courage to appear with a novel SS design in
a world full of men
including out Phil A who predictably has called this fine lady a long list of
names
which are all derogatory, and totally undeserved.
It shows that our Phil is a raving mysogenist and nut case.

I have posted quite a few posts at aus.hi-fi urging him to see a psychiatrist.

His ability to reason has become quite dysfunctional.

Over the past few months he has been quite reasonable imho,
but suddenly he has plummeted over the edge.

If anyone should take a look at the google archives of aus.hi-fi
for the last week they will see all the evidence that Phil is quite mentally ill
at this time.

The crew at aus.hi-fi have wasted no time in abusing this otherwise intelligent
and perceptive man when he isn't suffering his mental condition, and several
Phil Allison imposters have sprung up to ensure he looks a complete fool
and blithering idiot.

Patrick Turner.

"Patrick Turner"

** FYI:

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal (in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




.......... Phil

Maybe you guys have known it all along, but right now Phil A's mental state
has degenerated to the point where posts such as the one below
have only three new letters.
The rest of the post is one he's posted about 10 times.

I do hope he recovers from his mental illness soon
since we prefer he display his intelligence, sharp wit and astute perceptions
about
technical matters which are beyond the grasp of many in the news groups.

Unfortunately, I cannot recommend a good psychiatrist as i don't know any.

Patrick Turner.

And the repeating unfortunate post is as follows :-


Phil Allison wrote:

"Patrick Turner"

** FYI:

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal (in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.

......... Phil

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...


bill ramsay wrote:

On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 01:05:42 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:



** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal
(in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is
merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even
consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in
audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




......... Phil



what started you off this time?

I doubt Phil could even begin to answer your question properly.

I'll try to be brief.

Phil appears to have suffered a mental breakdown.

It seems to have occured as a result of my refusal to examine
mosfet data with regard to a class A mosfet amp designed by a british
female
by the name of Sue Parker.
( A google search, 'Sue Parker zeus amplifier' will bring up the links to
her
informative site. )


I like this fine female. She has the courage to appear with a novel SS
design in
a world full of men
including out Phil A who predictably has called this fine lady a long list
of
names
which are all derogatory, and totally undeserved.
It shows that our Phil is a raving mysogenist and nut case.

I have posted quite a few posts at aus.hi-fi urging him to see a
psychiatrist.

His ability to reason has become quite dysfunctional.

Over the past few months he has been quite reasonable imho,
but suddenly he has plummeted over the edge.

If anyone should take a look at the google archives of aus.hi-fi
for the last week they will see all the evidence that Phil is quite
mentally ill
at this time.

The crew at aus.hi-fi have wasted no time in abusing this otherwise
intelligent
and perceptive man when he isn't suffering his mental condition, and
several
Phil Allison imposters have sprung up to ensure he looks a complete fool
and blithering idiot.

Patrick Turner.


For the benefit of those who don't frequent aus.hi-fi.

Part of what Patrick says is true. Yes Phil is having a bit of an "episode"
as of late, but let's put things into perspective. Most of the grief Phil
gets he brings on himself. He has truly lost the plot in the past few days
and one can only feel pity for the man. To illustrate just how off the
rails he really is he can't even accept an accolade without thinking someone
is trying to take the **** out of him. It's sad and rather pathetic really.
I don't have a solution to his problem and as Patrick will most likely
attest to, it pointless even trying to side with him. All you'll get is
abuse hurled at you. Perhaps just not responding to anything he says for a
while might get him to calm down to at least some sort of state of
rationality.

Cheers,
Alan

"Patrick Turner"

** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal
(in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is
merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even
consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in
audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.


what started you off this time?

I doubt Phil could even begin to answer your question properly.


** The Turneroid is in a state of stark autistic terror over *nothing*.

I intend to keep him in that state for a while longer yet :-) .

The Turneroid appears to have suffered a mental breakdown. It seems to have
occured as a result of my request for him to examine basic mosfet data with
regard to a class A mosfet amp design by a pommy woman. Pat is besotted
with this dopey female.

She has the stupidity to appear with a ridiculous SS design on her own site.

Pat Turner is a raving misogynist and nut case - I have posted on
aus.hi-fi saying he is beyond help from a psychiatrist.

His ability to reason has become quite dysfunctional - even worse than
usual. Over the past few months he has been quite reasonable imho, but
suddenly he has plummeted over the edge into autistic terror at being
presented with something he does not know and should know.

If anyone should take a look at the google archives of aus.hi-fi for the
last week they will see all the evidence that Pat is quite mentally ill at
this time.





............... Phil

For the benefit of those who don't frequent aus.hi-fi.

Part of what Patrick says is true. Yes Phil is having a bit of an "episode"
as of late, but let's put things into perspective. Most of the grief Phil
gets he brings on himself. He has truly lost the plot in the past few days
and one can only feel pity for the man. To illustrate just how off the
rails he really is he can't even accept an accolade without thinking someone
is trying to take the **** out of him. It's sad and rather pathetic really.
I don't have a solution to his problem and as Patrick will most likely
attest to, it pointless even trying to side with him. All you'll get is
abuse hurled at you. Perhaps just not responding to anything he says for a
while might get him to calm down to at least some sort of state of
rationality.

Cheers,
Alan

I am keeping my responses to a minimum.
Note that there isn't much to respond to, since Phil
just keeps posting all his weirdo mind matter like a sick parrot.

The folks at rec.audio.tubes where I hang out a fair bit are all a wake up to
crazy Phil and his BS.

Patrick Turner.

Phil, only one of us is INSANE at the moment, and its you.

Now you are saying that I have all your symptoms of insanity.

You continue to act in a way that illustrates your absurd way of thinking.

Below you lie to the world by saying that I am somehow seriously attracted to
Ms Sue Parker about whom you publically insulted and denigated for no legitimate
reason,
and you said...

"Pat is besotted with this dopey female.."

Then you said, again another lie,

" Pat Turner is a raving misogynist and nut case...."

Now you can't have it both ways Phil.
The contradiction is obvious; if I was attracted to Sue
then how could that be if I was a mysogenist, ( a woman hater for those
who don't understand what a mysogenist is ).

Phil seems to have a considerable problem with women.

You are fairly insane Phil, but sane enough to cobble together the
most woeful lot of bull**** the world has ever seen.

I do hope your sessions with your psychiatrist are leading to a result.

Patrick Turner.




Phil Allison wrote:

"Patrick Turner"

** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal
(in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is
merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even
consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in
audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.


what started you off this time?

I doubt Phil could even begin to answer your question properly.

** The Turneroid is in a state of stark autistic terror over *nothing*.

I intend to keep him in that state for a while longer yet :-) .

The Turneroid appears to have suffered a mental breakdown. It seems to have
occured as a result of my request for him to examine basic mosfet data with
regard to a class A mosfet amp design by a pommy woman. Pat is besotted
with this dopey female.

She has the stupidity to appear with a ridiculous SS design on her own site.

Pat Turner is a raving misogynist and nut case - I have posted on
aus.hi-fi saying he is beyond help from a psychiatrist.

His ability to reason has become quite dysfunctional - even worse than
usual. Over the past few months he has been quite reasonable imho, but
suddenly he has plummeted over the edge into autistic terror at being
presented with something he does not know and should know.

If anyone should take a look at the google archives of aus.hi-fi for the
last week they will see all the evidence that Pat is quite mentally ill at
this time.

.............. Phil

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...
:
Patrick please see the error of your ways? You are wasting
your life trying to rationalise with Phil and it just won't
work.

No one else cares what he thinks. Walk away and get on with
your life and your business.

Regards TT

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:17:17 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:


"Patrick Turner"

** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal
(in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is
merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even
consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in
audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.


what started you off this time?

I doubt Phil could even begin to answer your question properly.


** The Turneroid is in a state of stark autistic terror over *nothing*.

I intend to keep him in that state for a while longer yet :-) .

The Turneroid appears to have suffered a mental breakdown. It seems to have
occured as a result of my request for him to examine basic mosfet data with
regard to a class A mosfet amp design by a pommy woman. Pat is besotted
with this dopey female.

She has the stupidity to appear with a ridiculous SS design on her own site.


there is no SS design on her website, what it says is OS, and it is
a key to put on a keyboard to replace the windows sign. Her thinking
is that the keyboards that she has designed can also be used by MAC
and linux users.



Pat Turner is a raving misogynist and nut case - I have posted on
aus.hi-fi saying he is beyond help from a psychiatrist.

His ability to reason has become quite dysfunctional - even worse than
usual. Over the past few months he has been quite reasonable imho, but
suddenly he has plummeted over the edge into autistic terror at being
presented with something he does not know and should know.

If anyone should take a look at the google archives of aus.hi-fi for the
last week they will see all the evidence that Pat is quite mentally ill at
this time.





.............. Phil

"bill ramsay"
"Phil Allison"


there is no SS design on her website,


** Try scrolling down - dickwad.


http://www.susan-parker.co.uk/





............ Phil

If we pretend Phil doesn't exist, will he stop posting?

Will we even care if he doesn't, since in our minds he is nobody?

I think any acknowledgement directed at him is positive reinforcement
for him to continue as he is, sick or not... the best thing we can do
is ignore him and hope he visits a shrink.

"Geoff" wrote in message


If we pretend Phil doesn't exist, will he stop posting?

It takes a long time for this to take hold, if my
experiences with the nuts at RAO is any indication.

in article ,
Alan Rutlidge at wrote on 8/31/05 1:43
AM:


"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...


bill ramsay wrote:

On Tue, 30 Aug 2005 01:05:42 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:



** The Turneroid Autistic ****wit has gone into melt down.

Just like " Robby the Robot " the Turneroid Autistic ****wit goes
completely haywire with arms waving about and sparks flying inside his
mechanical brain when given a command that conflicts with his internal
(in
his case bizarre) program.

What the Turneroid Autistic ****wit is ABSOLUTELY refusing to do is
merely
look at a data sheet OR do a five minute Google search OR even
consider
the simple matter of how to identify a common electronic part used in
audio
amplifiers.

I could easily just post the answer but the Turneroid Autistic ****wit
stubbornly and INSANELY refuses to ask - his pathetic ego, his bizarre
paranoia and his extreme autism refuses to let him.

Mr Turner - you are basically a pile of sub human ****.

YOU are a mental retard and an autistic pig.

I will continue rubbing your ugly nose in those undeniable facts.




......... Phil



what started you off this time?

I doubt Phil could even begin to answer your question properly.

I'll try to be brief.

Phil appears to have suffered a mental breakdown.

It seems to have occured as a result of my refusal to examine
mosfet data with regard to a class A mosfet amp designed by a british
female
by the name of Sue Parker.
( A google search, 'Sue Parker zeus amplifier' will bring up the links to
her
informative site. )


I like this fine female. She has the courage to appear with a novel SS
design in
a world full of men
including out Phil A who predictably has called this fine lady a long list
of
names
which are all derogatory, and totally undeserved.
It shows that our Phil is a raving mysogenist and nut case.

I have posted quite a few posts at aus.hi-fi urging him to see a
psychiatrist.

His ability to reason has become quite dysfunctional.

Over the past few months he has been quite reasonable imho,
but suddenly he has plummeted over the edge.

If anyone should take a look at the google archives of aus.hi-fi
for the last week they will see all the evidence that Phil is quite
mentally ill
at this time.

The crew at aus.hi-fi have wasted no time in abusing this otherwise
intelligent
and perceptive man when he isn't suffering his mental condition, and
several
Phil Allison imposters have sprung up to ensure he looks a complete fool
and blithering idiot.

Patrick Turner.


For the benefit of those who don't frequent aus.hi-fi.

Part of what Patrick says is true. Yes Phil is having a bit of an "episode"
as of late, but let's put things into perspective. Most of the grief Phil
gets he brings on himself. He has truly lost the plot in the past few days
and one can only feel pity for the man. To illustrate just how off the
rails he really is he can't even accept an accolade without thinking someone
is trying to take the **** out of him. It's sad and rather pathetic really.
I don't have a solution to his problem and as Patrick will most likely
attest to, it pointless even trying to side with him. All you'll get is
abuse hurled at you. Perhaps just not responding to anything he says for a
while might get him to calm down to at least some sort of state of
rationality.

Cheers,
Alan




I do have a solution to the problem. It's called a kill-filter. Phil has
been actively blocked by mine for some time now. I don't miss his nasty
potty mouth. There are plenty of other lunatics to take up the slack . . .
..

Ditto with the Anry / Middius / whoever-else-jumps-in exchanges that ramble
on interminably and say absolutely nothing.

As the ad says, "Try it. You'll like it."

J

Phil Allison has the stupidity to say .........

"She has the stupidity to appear with a ridiculous SS design on her own site."

Now Bill, the link to her website is

http://www.susan-parker.co.uk/zeus-toroid-amp-1.htm

there is no SS design on her website, what it says is OS, and it is
a key to put on a keyboard to replace the windows sign. Her thinking
is that the keyboards that she has designed can also be used by MAC
and linux users.

I've deleted the outpourings of the mentally sick Phil.

The lady uses one input transformer, a pair of power mosfets,
and one output transformer.

I haven't noticed the parts of her site that are devoted to keyboard design.

Patrick Turner.

"Arny Krueger"
"Geoff"
If we pretend Phil doesn't exist, will he stop posting?


It takes a long time for this to take hold, if my experiences with the
nuts at RAO is any indication.



** Please tell us Rev. Krueger - if we all pretend that God does not
exist ....

How long will it take for the Devil to take hold ???





.......... Phil

Geoff wrote:

If we pretend Phil doesn't exist, will he stop posting?

no.



Will we even care if he doesn't, since in our minds he is nobody?

depends.



I think any acknowledgement directed at him is positive reinforcement
for him to continue as he is, sick or not... the best thing we can do
is ignore him and hope he visits a shrink.

And we give him reason to visit.

Patrick Turner.

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:08:16 GMT, Patrick Turner
wrote:


The folks at rec.audio.tubes where I hang out a fair bit are all a wake up to
crazy Phil and his BS.

Does that mean they have an answer to the problem?

paul packer wrote:

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:08:16 GMT, Patrick Turner
wrote:

The folks at rec.audio.tubes where I hang out a fair bit are all a wake up to
crazy Phil and his BS.

Does that mean they have an answer to the problem?

Yeah, its called the kilfile.

Phil Allison would have the unique claim to notoriety
of being the most kill-filed person at rec.audio.tubes.

Patrick Turner.

"Patrick Turner"

Phil Allison would have the unique claim to notoriety
of being the most kill-filed person at rec.audio.tubes.



** But never the distinction of having destroyed a whole newsgroup.

The trophy for that monstrous achievement goes to one Patrick Turner Esq.






.......... Phil

Jon Yaeger said:

I do have a solution to the problem. It's called a kill-filter. Phil has
been actively blocked by mine for some time now. I don't miss his nasty
potty mouth. There are plenty of other lunatics to take up the slack . . .


Ditto with the Anry / Middius / whoever-else-jumps-in exchanges that ramble
on interminably and say absolutely nothing.

As the ad says, "Try it. You'll like it."



One of my fav LV quotes:
"Don't likee, no clickee!".

Kill files are no solution, every once in a while Phil writes sensible
and usefull stuff about electronics.

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 19:49:01 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:


"bill ramsay"
"Phil Allison"


there is no SS design on her website,


** Try scrolling down - dickwad.


http://www.susan-parker.co.uk/





........... Phil

like i said there is no SS symbols on her site, scrolling down or
otherwise.

it's all part of your infantile imagination

in article , Sander deWaal at
wrote on 8/31/05 1:29 PM:

Jon Yaeger said:

I do have a solution to the problem. It's called a kill-filter. Phil has
been actively blocked by mine for some time now. I don't miss his nasty
potty mouth. There are plenty of other lunatics to take up the slack . . .


Ditto with the Anry / Middius / whoever-else-jumps-in exchanges that ramble
on interminably and say absolutely nothing.

As the ad says, "Try it. You'll like it."



One of my fav LV quotes:
"Don't likee, no clickee!".

Kill files are no solution, every once in a while Phil writes sensible
and usefull stuff about electronics.


Sure, Phil is brilliant and right on sometimes. But the noise/signal ratio
is way too high for me.

It's like one of my favorite college FM jazz stations. Some days
atmospheric conditions are better than others, and the static is tolerable.
Other times I can't stand it and I change the station . . . .

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 23:20:33 +1000, "Phil Allison"
wrote:


"Arny Krueger"
"Geoff"
If we pretend Phil doesn't exist, will he stop posting?


It takes a long time for this to take hold, if my experiences with the
nuts at RAO is any indication.



** Please tell us Rev. Krueger - if we all pretend that God does not
exist ....

How long will it take for the Devil to take hold ???





.......... Phil


So THAT'S it! You think you are GOD!!

And all this time I thought you were just a minion...