[Phildo]

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Phildo" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

I'm still looking for a lucid explanation of what makes a
general-purpose mixing console suitable for recording and unsuitable for
live sound.

That statement alone speaks volumes about why you should not be posting
to aapls.

No Phildo, the absence of such a thing shows how arbitrarily claims like
this are tossed around.

No Arnold, I was right the first time. You don't know enough to be trying to
dispense advice on live sound.

This post notwitstanding, you have given no logical reason why an 02R96
shouldn't be used for live sound, given that it has enough channels, etc.

I never said it shouldn't be used, just that it was not ideal. I've even
given you the reasons Arnold. Maybe I should try again using words of one
syllable?

I've been told by a local live sound eggspurt that Yamaha's 02R96 is
not suitable for live sound, I eventually found out that he arrived at
this opinion after he attempted to demonstrate one at a local venue, and
failed to coax anything out of its main outputs.

The guy was right in some respects. While it can be used for live sound,
it is not an ideal desk for a lot of situations sue to its complexity.

What complexity? Does a simple thing like layers blow your mind that much?

Not mine but a visiting engineer only used to analogue boards would have
real trouble using a board.

Does input and output patching confuse your little feeble brain?

Arnold, I use a PM1D, a waaaaaaay more complicated desk than your puny
little offering, one you can only dream about using but which is reserved
for us real sound engineers.

Are parametric equalizers too much for you to learn how to use, except
with great difficulty?

I use them every single day Arnold. I also use meters to set the channel
gains, something you still haven't learned to do.

Maybe complex to you, Phildo. To me the 02R96 is hardly complex at all.

You already admitted yourself you don't have a clue how to use it. Setting
channel gains by using your ears instead of the meters is a recipe for
trouble on a digital board.

I have taught 4 people how to use it.

How can you do that when you don't know how to use it yourself? Talk about
the blind leading the blind.

Two had never used a mixing console before, and mixed a show using 20 or
so channels only an hour or two after they first saw it.

Pushing faders up and down is the easy bit. Ask him to set up the board from
scratch and it would be a different story.

The other one was experienced and virtually taught himself. There's a
girl, a junior in high school that just learned how to use our 02R96 to
mix a program with video and recorded music as well as a mic, in less than
1.5 hours from the first time she ever looked seriously at any mixer in
her whole life.

So? It took her 1.5 hours to learn to use the board better than you with all
your claimed (lied) years of pro live sound experience.

A visiting engineer cannot be shown how to use the desk in 5 minutes at
a festival for example.

Maybe that's true of the grade of sound tech that you hang with Phildo, as
well as your sweet self.

No Arnold, it is true of engineers all over the world, real engineers, not
just wannabes like yourself.

An experienced engineer should not need to be shown anything about an
02R96 in order to use it to almost immediately mix a show if they even
have just heard how digital mixers work from a friend. Faders are faders,
mutes are mutes, etc.

The O2R96 is not an ideal live desk. If you knew anything about live sound
then you would know that Arnold. All you are doing is showing everybody here
how little you know. Keep it up as there may be some tribes in the remotest
parts of the world who still don't know what a dumbass the Krueger is.

Same goes for the PM1D and to some extent the PM5D.

Those are just 02R96s for people who have to see every fader at the same
time in order to keep things straight in their head. ;-)

You wish Arnold. The PM1D is a board you have wet dreams about, one reserved
for the real engineers you are so desperately jealous of and want to be
like. All your comments show are that you know nothing about how the board
operates.

MC7L is a much better example for live sound use as it is simple to use
and only needs a few minutes for an experienced engineer to find his way
around it.

Been there, done that. See my comment above. My learning curve on first
sight of a M7CL was about was about 30 seconds.

Me too but if you understand that then you should also understandd why the
96 is not a very good choice for a live board (hence the reason they are
very rarely found at live gigs).

Then there's the LS9 - a little harder to use because it lacks the
touch-sensitive faders. Another 30 second learning curve.

Bull****. The LS9 is even easier to use then the MC7L.

Yamaha state it is suitable...

That's exactly right Phildo - Yamaha says that the 02R96 is recommended by
them for live sound, and you can't give a reason why not, except that
maybe for some odd reason it scares you and the people you hang with.

It is suitable. It is not ideal and there are much better choices out there.
You just don't want the people in your church to know you wasted their money
on a flash toy that you don't know how to use.

The 02R96 worked out great for us because it has the channels we need (32)
with a reasonable allowance for expansion, is easy to use, and is narrower
than most if not all of the Yamaha digital consoles with a comparable
number of channels. The fact that we picked one up with a new equipment
warranty for less than $8K was very sweet.

If it works for you then all well and good (although they still need someone
who knows how to use it). There is a reason that board is very rarely used
for live gigs and the fact you cannot see what that reason is just shows
everybody here why you shouldn't be posting about live sound.

Phildo