[Arny Krueger]

"John Byrns" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"John Byrns" wrote in message
...

In article .com,
Peter Wieck wrote:

On Sep 11, 6:24 pm, Andre Jute wrote:

For your information: all American V8 engines are 90 degree engines.


'Cept for a 1961 GM engine,

Peter, are you saying that GM had a 60 degree V8 gasoline engine that
was used in a 1961 US production automobile?

None that I know of.

True, the early 60s were a time of engine diversity for GM.

They had a relatively huge (3.3 liter) slant-4 cut out of a 90 degree V8.

They had that small aluminium V8 they eventually sold to Rover.

They made a car with an available I4 cut off of an I6, which was a real
throw-back in those days.

The I4 was later resurrected as the "Iron Duke"

Exactly. It was offered in the initial Chevy II, but about zero were ever
sold. GM redirected it into the industrial engine market and by all
acccounts, it sold and served well. It was just the ticket for a small
combine or big irrigation pump.

They had a flat 6 that was built like a motorcycle engine with jugs.

I had one of those, a great little engine.

As did I, 140 gross hp and 4 single-barrel carbs. I ran it long enough for
the jug gaskets to leak like sieves.

You forgot the SOHC I6 they had in the mid 1960s.

Note my OP - "early 60s". Yes, they did the OHC I6 for Pontiac in, if memory
serves, 1966. The Wikipedia agrees.

I think this one may
have been the first automobile engine to use the now ubiquitous timing
belt to drive the cam.

You mean the now-ubiquitous steel-reinforced-rubber timing belt... There a
Fiat OHC I4 with one that was also introduced in 1966 - the 124. Fiat's
implementation included a camshaft that would go idle after belt breakage
with valves interfering with the pistons. Thus a minor belt failure became a
total engine failure.

also owned one of these, I love most all GM 6
cylinder engines, except maybe the old Pontiac flathead six. I also
owned a couple of GM's cast iron 60 degree V6 engines.

My first driver was an old 1958 chevvy Biscayne with the old "Blue Flame"
235 I6. You know, the one that was in the first Corvette. ;-)

They had a 90 degree V6 in the days when conventional wisdom was that V6s
needed to be 60 degrees. (hold that thouught!) No balance shaft, either!
Can
we say rock and roll? ;-)

IIRC this engine was developed to replace the ill fated aluminum V6 that
they dumped on Rover,

The aluminum that Rover got was a 214 V8. There was a turbocharged version
of it with water injection - Oldsmobile.

and IIRC it was derived from an existing V8 so it
could be built on the same line with existing tooling.

The V8 that begat the 90 degree V6 was the smalleruick "Nail head" cast iron
V8.

It soon went the
way of the aluminum V8 and was sold to Willis/Jeep, GM eventually bought
it back in the 1970s.

Agreed, except that by then Willys/Jeep was part of AMC.

They eventually converted it to an "even fire"
design with a special crank

That was the original design - a *special* crank. However they updated it,
and finally added a balance shaft.

and both my and my wife's automobiles are
powered by this engine today. It seems smooth enough to me, with
minimal if any "rock and roll". The 60 degree V6 I mentioned above did
have a serious case of "rock and roll".

I've owned 7 60 degree V6s, Nissan (1) , GM (3) and Ford (3). One is
smoother than the next. OK, the first chevvy V6 I had was a little rough,
but it also had a carburator. I blame the carb. FI made all the difference
on its sucessor with the same everything else. A 60 degree V6 that rocks
and rolls does so for reasons other than inherent balance.

My daughter owned a recent copy Chrysler's 3.8L 90 degree V6 (Liberty), and
it still had a little rock-and-roll at idle. I've driven a prototype of the
upgraded NVH version of the same car, and it is better but still has a bit
of the classic 90 degree V6 lope. For some odd reason I've never knowingly
driven one of the General's 90 degree V6s with the balance shaft, so I don't
know about it. I kay have ridden on one or three, so if there's nothing to
report, it must be pretty good.

The GM 90 degree V6 I did drive was in a 1964 Buick Special, back in the
day.

I seriously doubt it if
that is what you are implying, if you are correct it surely must have
been GM's best kept secret ever, can you cite any references?

I'm waiting with bated breath!

Just don't hold your breath.

No, holding one's breath for most of these turkeys to take a correction with
grace could result in a very blue face.