On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 22:16:10 +0200, "Ruud Broens"
wrote:
"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
.. .
: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005 16:48:41 +0200, "Ruud Broens"
: wrote:
some snippin' required, so here goes
: : Your idiocy continues. That's the noise floor of the concert hall,
: : only studio recordings are able to get below a 30dB noise floor, and
: : that would require pretty quiet breathing on the part of the
: : performers.
: : As noted above, with only me sitting quietly in it, my
: : listening room is somewhere in the mid-20s (very difficult to measure
: : due to self-noise in the microphone).
: Interesting tactic - first rewriting music as _live music_, then claiming
: from that point onwards that's what i wrote
: - taken lessons in the debating trade ?
:
: Your stupidity appears to be unbounded - specifying live music, i.e.
: acoustic jazz, classical etc, works in your favour, as amplified music
: has even less dynamic range.
:
First: studio recording of acoustical instruments result in music registrations
--what's your hangup with 'concert hall noise floor' as being in some way
relevant with such a registration?
What, you think that studios don't have a noise floor?
Self-noise of competent microphones is below
20 dB SPL, eg. AT 3035 - a USD 200 job - states 12 dB SPL eq. noise level
Close miking just about anything will quickly get you in the 110+ dB SPL
range, so a 100 dB range is possible for sure.
Utter bull****! Put one musician in that studio, and your 12dB floor
immediately jumps to at least 20dB, more likely 25 as soon as he
begins to play, and is therefore not sitting absolutely still. Do you
have *any* concept of how quiet 20dB is? At that level (and I have
spent some time in anechoic chambers - very unpleasant) the only
sounds you can hear are your clothing rustling as you breathe, your
own breathing, and the blood coursing through your ears. It usually
takes about two minutes of sitting absolutely still in an utterly
quiet environment before you can perceive these noises.
A typical string quartet will generate something like 30-35 dB in the
rests between playing. Basically Ruud, your every post reveals that
you know absolutely nothing about acoustics.
Of course this also depends on
the lowest acoustical level attainable from the instrument/environment .
Directional microphones / noise gates, etc. are used to minimize mechanical
noise,
if necessary.
The master recording's dynamic range can, depending on composition, etc.,
very well be in excess of 90 dB.
I repeat, there is *no* music master tape with a dynamic range of more
than 80dB, so as ever, your fanciful musings are at odds with reality.
I believe it was dbx claiming a 100 dB requirement for the recording of
acoustical instruments' performances.
What a company *selling* companders may claim, has nothing to do with
reality. Note that compansion is no longer used, since CD took over
the music market.
Second: many types of music don't use acoustical instruments, or exclusively so,
yet also do not start out as amplified music, so another strawman there noted.
*Many* types? I don't think so, but even there you're quite wrong -
see below.
Electronically generated signals can have pretty much a dynamic range that
is limited by the electronics used, that is *well over 100 dB*.
Actually, it's more like 70-75 dB for real-world electronic
instruments. Get a grip, and stop making things up. The *reality* is
that *no* music master tape, Pet Shop Boys and Mike Oldfield included,
has a dynamic range of more then 80dB. Until you can find such a tape,
please stop making such a fool of yourself.
: : As from environmental factors, 27 dB daytime eq. reported in NL iirc.
: : That's in average living rooms, should be better in your dedicated room
: : , i presume.
: :
: : I have yet to find an *average* living room that quiet, I'd have said
: : that 30-35 dB was more normal in daytime, more for urban dwellings.
: :
: : I'm not confusing, i'm detracting one from the other, eh ?
: : in this case**, 110 - 20 = 90 dB range.
: :
: : From where did you get the 20?
: I got lucky - found it in a breakfast cereal box
: - where did you find your 40, P.?
:
: Acoustics textbooks, also wide experience or real concert halls.
:
make up your mind: is it wide experience OR real concert halls ?
Typo, that should have been 'of', not 'or'. An *honest* debater would
have realised this, and avoided such a pathetic cheap shot.
:-)
: ...deceptive editing noted.....**
:
: : but anyway, surely you're not
: : saying that the background noise level in a listening room should
: : dictate the range that should be captured on a medium ?
: :
: : No, you completely misread what I wrote. For most people, it does
: : however set a limit of around 70-80dB in the replay system, from the
: : 30-35 of the room noise floor to the 105-110 of the system at the
: : listening position.
:
: agreed.
:
: Exceptionally quiet rooms housing exceptionally
: : powerful systems can extend this to a little more than 90dB, which is
: : wider than you'll ever need.
:
: a little more ? need ?? to use a direct quote: Bull****!
: evidently, _you_ misread music as live music ...
: without it, of course, you argumentation falls utterly apart.
:
: What lunacy is this? What kind of music do you now claim you are
: talking about?
See above.
As I said - lunacy. And ignorance.
--
Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering
|