Amp for Sennheiser 580s?

[Steve]

Hi, I am looking for an amp that can go with the Sennheiser 580 headphones
that I recently ordered. I have been reading somewhere that they need amps
to work properly on cd players, computers, and other equipment. Most of the
headphone's use will be on my computer when I am at the university listening
to music, movies and games. So I was wondering if anyone can recommend an
amp to get? I don't want to spend too much money, but then again I don't
want to buy a piece of junk. So if anyone can recommend an amp I'd really
appreciate it. Thanks in advance,
Steve

[Arny Krueger]

"Steve" > wrote in message


> Hi, I am looking for an amp that can go with the Sennheiser 580
> headphones that I recently ordered. I have been reading somewhere
> that they need amps to work properly on cd players, computers, and
> other equipment.

You can read all sorts of weird things. This story about 580's needing
headphone amps is probably based on the fact that their impedance is about
10 times that of most other phones. IME, high impedance or not, I plug
them into standard headphone jacks all over the place and just work.

Let's go down a partial list of places I use my 580s

- The headphone jack on the little integrated amp I use with my TV
- Nomad 2
- Nomad Jukebox 3
- Panasonic portable CD player
- RCA cassette/FM (recent power outage)
- SoundBlaster Audigy OEM (low output) sound card in this PC
- Turtle Beach Santa Cruz sound card in another PC
- LynxTWO sound card


>Most of the headphone's use will be on my computer
> when I am at the university listening to music, movies and games. So
> I was wondering if anyone can recommend an amp to get?

IME headphone amps are needed with 580's in only exceptional cases.

And hey, I'm not speaking from total ignorance here. I have a Rane headphone
amp but it just isn't necessary with most of my uses of the 580

>I don't want
> to spend too much money, but then again I don't want to buy a piece
> of junk. So if anyone can recommend an amp I'd really appreciate it.

Before you spend money you don't need to spend, plug 'em in and see how they
work for you.

I like things on the loud side, and I use my 580s with every kind of device
you've mentioned, all by themselves.

[Robert Morein]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "Steve" > wrote in message
>
>
> > Hi, I am looking for an amp that can go with the Sennheiser 580
> > headphones that I recently ordered. I have been reading somewhere
> > that they need amps to work properly on cd players, computers, and
> > other equipment.
>
> You can read all sorts of weird things. This story about 580's needing
> headphone amps is probably based on the fact that their impedance is about
> 10 times that of most other phones. IME, high impedance or not, I plug
> them into standard headphone jacks all over the place and just work.
>
I use them also.
They will probably work with most AC powered items.
They are definitely not sensitive enough for CD and Walkmans.
Arny, how do you manage to get enough output out of that RCA? Is it a 4 AA
unit?

[Arny Krueger]

"Robert Morein" > wrote in message


> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> ...

>> "Steve" > wrote in message
>>

>>> Hi, I am looking for an amp that can go with the Sennheiser 580
>>> headphones that I recently ordered. I have been reading somewhere
>>> that they need amps to work properly on cd players, computers, and
>>> other equipment.

>> You can read all sorts of weird things. This story about 580's
>> needing headphone amps is probably based on the fact that their
>> impedance is about 10 times that of most other phones. IME, high
>> impedance or not, I plug them into standard headphone jacks all
>> over the place and just work.

> I use them also.

> They will probably work with most AC powered items.

Agreed.

> They are definitely not sensitive enough for CD and Walkmans.

Robert, I can't deny you your perceptions in matters like this, but I'm
still scratching my head. When I hand people headphones I've been listening
to, I either knock the volume down quite a bit or they complain about how
loud they are.

> Arny, how do you manage to get enough output out of that RCA?

Turn down the volume, a fair amount. I was amazed at how loud it could get.

>Is it a 4 AA unit?

Nope, just 2 AA.

Now for something really strange, consider my Nomad 2: It runs on 1 AA.

I will admit that my NJB3 cranks pretty nice with the 5 volt Lithium cell,
but it doesn't get as loud as that crappy little RCA I was using to listen
to FM when the power was out.

I must have the most sensitive 580s ever made. I dunno, got 'em cheap &
factory sealed on eBay. But look at the list of phones I routinely use and
what I use them with. Seems like a lot of territory gets covered.

I think that the best strategy for Steve is for him to wait until he gets
the phones, listen to them for a while, and then take what he thinks is the
appropriate action.

[Blaster]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "Robert Morein" > wrote in message
>

<snip>

> I think that the best strategy for Steve is for him to wait until he gets
> the phones, listen to them for a while, and then take what he thinks is
the
> appropriate action.

Agreed. I have the 580's and the Grado SR60's, and have found the SR60's to
work somewhat better on certain applications (PC sound cards, portable disc
players). However, I wouldn't invest in a headphone amp unless I could try
it and return it if the sound improvement wasn't noticeable.

[Robert Morein]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "Robert Morein" > wrote in message
>
>
> > "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> > ...
>
> >> "Steve" > wrote in message
> >>
>
> >>> Hi, I am looking for an amp that can go with the Sennheiser 580
> >>> headphones that I recently ordered. I have been reading somewhere
> >>> that they need amps to work properly on cd players, computers, and
> >>> other equipment.
>
> >> You can read all sorts of weird things. This story about 580's
> >> needing headphone amps is probably based on the fact that their
> >> impedance is about 10 times that of most other phones. IME, high
> >> impedance or not, I plug them into standard headphone jacks all
> >> over the place and just work.
>
> > I use them also.
>
> > They will probably work with most AC powered items.
>
> Agreed.
>
> > They are definitely not sensitive enough for CD and Walkmans.
>
> Robert, I can't deny you your perceptions in matters like this, but I'm
> still scratching my head. When I hand people headphones I've been
listening
> to, I either knock the volume down quite a bit or they complain about how
> loud they are.
>
> > Arny, how do you manage to get enough output out of that RCA?
>
> Turn down the volume, a fair amount. I was amazed at how loud it could
get.
>
> >Is it a 4 AA unit?
>
> Nope, just 2 AA.
>
> Now for something really strange, consider my Nomad 2: It runs on 1 AA.
>
> I will admit that my NJB3 cranks pretty nice with the 5 volt Lithium cell,
> but it doesn't get as loud as that crappy little RCA I was using to listen
> to FM when the power was out.
>
> I must have the most sensitive 580s ever made. I dunno, got 'em cheap &
> factory sealed on eBay. But look at the list of phones I routinely use and
> what I use them with. Seems like a lot of territory gets covered.
>
> I think that the best strategy for Steve is for him to wait until he gets
> the phones, listen to them for a while, and then take what he thinks is
the
> appropriate action.
>
It's not inconceivable that later model 580's might have higher sensitivity.
A friend of mine and I mutually reached the conclusion that the Sony
MDR-V600 is a better choice for portable apps.
It has much higher sensitivity than our 580 samples, and a closed back,
which is useful if you're on a noisy train.

[Arny Krueger]

"Robert Morein" > wrote in message


> It's not inconceivable that later model 580's might have higher
> sensitivity.

It's possible.

>A friend of mine and I mutually reached the conclusion
> that the Sony MDR-V600 is a better choice for portable apps.

As close as I've gotten to those is my Sony 7506 which are from the same
family of products, but not the same product. I believe that the common
component is the driver which is among the flattest on the market.

> It has much higher sensitivity than our 580 samples, and a closed
> back, which is useful if you're on a noisy train.

It's definitely brighter. Depending on your tastes, that's either the good
news or the bad news. IME none of the Sony MDR V600/MDR V6/MDR 7506 family
are as comfortable in the long haul as the Sennheiser 580s.

For portable listening, the value/performance/isolation leaders are IME the
Sony EX-70 ear buds, which provide a similar kind of sound. Reasonably
smooth, strong bass, pretty bright.

One hidden agenda item in any discussion of headphones and ear buds is that
the structure of the individual ear very much affects their frequency
response and comfort. A headphone that sounds smooth and balanced for one
person can easily be peaky and harsh for the next. Personal taste explains
part of it, but in fact the equipment is performing significantly
differently as well.

[Arny Krueger]

"Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message


> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Steve" > wrote in message
>>
>>
>>> Hi, I am looking for an amp that can go with the Sennheiser 580
>>> headphones that I recently ordered. I have been reading somewhere
>>> that they need amps to work properly on cd players, computers, and
>>> other equipment.
>>
>> You can read all sorts of weird things. This story about 580's
>> needing headphone amps is probably based on the fact that their
>> impedance is about 10 times that of most other phones. IME, high
>> impedance or not, I plug them into standard headphone jacks all
>> over the place and just work.
>>
>> Let's go down a partial list of places I use my 580s
>>
>> - The headphone jack on the little integrated amp I use with my TV
>> - Nomad 2
>> - Nomad Jukebox 3
>> - Panasonic portable CD player
>> - RCA cassette/FM (recent power outage)
>> - SoundBlaster Audigy OEM (low output) sound card in this PC
>> - Turtle Beach Santa Cruz sound card in another PC
>> - LynxTWO sound card
>>
>>
>>> Most of the headphone's use will be on my computer
>>> when I am at the university listening to music, movies and games. So
>>> I was wondering if anyone can recommend an amp to get?
>>
>> IME headphone amps are needed with 580's in only exceptional cases.
>>
>> And hey, I'm not speaking from total ignorance here. I have a Rane
>> headphone amp but it just isn't necessary with most of my uses of
>> the 580
>>
>>> I don't want
>>> to spend too much money, but then again I don't want to buy a piece
>>> of junk. So if anyone can recommend an amp I'd really appreciate it.
>>
>> Before you spend money you don't need to spend, plug 'em in and see
>> how they work for you.
>>
>> I like things on the loud side, and I use my 580s with every kind of
>> device you've mentioned, all by themselves.

> I don't believe anyone should be listening to these, or other good
> headphones, via crappy headphone jacks.

Of course you have every right to believe what you will, but how do your
beliefs apply to others?

>They should instead by powered by a decent headphone amp receiving signal
from equipment's
> audio/tape outputs.

Which begs the question why then are so many people putting crappy headphone
jacks on relatively pricey equipment like Nomad Jukeboxes and iPods?

I've discussing this problem in another thread on rec.audio.tech, and
obtained what I find to be a key admission from another headphone amp
proponent.

There's apparently this widespread belief that turning volume controls up
much over 50% (12 o'clock) is *always* a bad thing. Ironically, half-way on
a log control is something like 20 dB or more below maximum gain, which is
quite a bit less than full output.

In fact, the usual case I've found in testing headphone jacks on personal
portable equipment is that the equipment doesn't clip or just barely clips
when the volume control is at 100%. I've seen some exceptions, but I'd go so
far as to say this is a general rule with some exceptions, rather than an
exceptional case.

Given the widespread concern about people damaging their ears with
headphones, building equipment so that 100% volume settings would correspond
to maximum practical loudness makes sense. If you leave 20 dB or reserve
gain, there's ample opportunity for people to damage their ears.

This is counter-intuitive for people experienced with most car and home
systems that often start clipping when the volume control is advanced past
about 1 or 2 o'clock.

I've run into similar feelings among people who have problems using
so-called passive preamps with CD players and power amps. Most CD players
put out 2 volts or more. Most power amps start clipping with 1.5 volts or
less input. It should always work, but you just might have to turn the
volume up to 100% (5 o'clock) to get full output. And frankly, some people
tolerate some clipping when they listen loud.

[Norman Schwartz]

I wasn't referring to problems purely related to sufficient volume levels
and the possibility of damaged hearing, etc.. It appears to be both true
and generally accepted fact that listening via equipment headphone jacks
degrades signal quality at *any* volume level setting. Therefore a headphone
amp is the way to go when using the better Sennheiser's if you wish to take
the most advantage of your headphones.

Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
>
>
> > "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> "Steve" > wrote in message
> >>
> >>
> >>> Hi, I am looking for an amp that can go with the Sennheiser 580
> >>> headphones that I recently ordered. I have been reading somewhere
> >>> that they need amps to work properly on cd players, computers, and
> >>> other equipment.
> >>
> >> You can read all sorts of weird things. This story about 580's
> >> needing headphone amps is probably based on the fact that their
> >> impedance is about 10 times that of most other phones. IME, high
> >> impedance or not, I plug them into standard headphone jacks all
> >> over the place and just work.
> >>
> >> Let's go down a partial list of places I use my 580s
> >>
> >> - The headphone jack on the little integrated amp I use with my TV
> >> - Nomad 2
> >> - Nomad Jukebox 3
> >> - Panasonic portable CD player
> >> - RCA cassette/FM (recent power outage)
> >> - SoundBlaster Audigy OEM (low output) sound card in this PC
> >> - Turtle Beach Santa Cruz sound card in another PC
> >> - LynxTWO sound card
> >>
> >>
> >>> Most of the headphone's use will be on my computer
> >>> when I am at the university listening to music, movies and games. So
> >>> I was wondering if anyone can recommend an amp to get?
> >>
> >> IME headphone amps are needed with 580's in only exceptional cases.
> >>
> >> And hey, I'm not speaking from total ignorance here. I have a Rane
> >> headphone amp but it just isn't necessary with most of my uses of
> >> the 580
> >>
> >>> I don't want
> >>> to spend too much money, but then again I don't want to buy a piece
> >>> of junk. So if anyone can recommend an amp I'd really appreciate it.
> >>
> >> Before you spend money you don't need to spend, plug 'em in and see
> >> how they work for you.
> >>
> >> I like things on the loud side, and I use my 580s with every kind of
> >> device you've mentioned, all by themselves.
>
> > I don't believe anyone should be listening to these, or other good
> > headphones, via crappy headphone jacks.
>
> Of course you have every right to believe what you will, but how do your
> beliefs apply to others?
>
> >They should instead by powered by a decent headphone amp receiving
signal
> from equipment's
> > audio/tape outputs.
>
> Which begs the question why then are so many people putting crappy
headphone
> jacks on relatively pricey equipment like Nomad Jukeboxes and iPods?
>
> I've discussing this problem in another thread on rec.audio.tech, and
> obtained what I find to be a key admission from another headphone amp
> proponent.
>
> There's apparently this widespread belief that turning volume controls up
> much over 50% (12 o'clock) is *always* a bad thing. Ironically, half-way
on
> a log control is something like 20 dB or more below maximum gain, which is
> quite a bit less than full output.
>
> In fact, the usual case I've found in testing headphone jacks on personal
> portable equipment is that the equipment doesn't clip or just barely clips
> when the volume control is at 100%. I've seen some exceptions, but I'd go
so
> far as to say this is a general rule with some exceptions, rather than an
> exceptional case.
>
> Given the widespread concern about people damaging their ears with
> headphones, building equipment so that 100% volume settings would
correspond
> to maximum practical loudness makes sense. If you leave 20 dB or reserve
> gain, there's ample opportunity for people to damage their ears.
>
> This is counter-intuitive for people experienced with most car and home
> systems that often start clipping when the volume control is advanced past
> about 1 or 2 o'clock.
>
> I've run into similar feelings among people who have problems using
> so-called passive preamps with CD players and power amps. Most CD players
> put out 2 volts or more. Most power amps start clipping with 1.5 volts or
> less input. It should always work, but you just might have to turn the
> volume up to 100% (5 o'clock) to get full output. And frankly, some people
> tolerate some clipping when they listen loud.
>
>
>
>

[Arny Krueger]

"Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message


> I wasn't referring to problems purely related to sufficient volume
> levels and the possibility of damaged hearing, etc..

OK

> It appears to
> be both true and generally accepted fact that listening via equipment
> headphone jacks degrades signal quality at *any* volume level
> setting.

The current context is headphone jacks on equipment that is designed
primarily for use with headphones. I gave a list of of equipment in the
first post you responded to Norman (you quoted the list!) , and this
description fits just about all of them.

>Therefore a headphone amp is the way to go when using the
> better Sennheiser's if you wish to take the most advantage of your
> headphones.

Maybe it would be good to consider the technical differences between the
headphone jack on a piece of equipment that is designed primarily for use
with headphones, and those on a headphone amp, which is after all a piece of
equipment that is designed primarily for use with headphones.

[Arny Krueger]

"Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message

> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
>> . net
>>> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>>> headphones.
>>>>
>>>> Maybe it would be good to consider the technical differences
>>>> between the headphone jack on a piece of equipment that is designed
>>>> primarily for use with headphones, and those on a headphone amp,
>>>> which is after all a piece of equipment that is designed primarily
>>>> for use with headphones.

>> There are two different ways that headphone jacks are driven from the
>> circuitry in audio gear. In some cases there is a dedicated headphone
>> amplifier, whose quality may vary. If you get a good implementation
>> of this, then using an external amp could be a waste. One finds this
>> sort of thing in equipment that is designed to drive headphones as
>> the primary output, but one also finds it in components like
>> recorders and players that are used for audio production or home
>> multimedia or hifi.

> One of my pre-amps (Adcom 565) has a headphone jack. I also have a
> Creek OBH-11SE headphone amp. Where would you suggest I might get the
> better quality sound from a Sennheiser HD600?

Not having the schematic diagrams or actual equipment for either device at
my disposal, I have no serious advice. However, if you think that your
headphones don't play loud enough suit you, you should try turning up the
volume. I don't mean this as an insult, because I have become aware of the
fact that some people are fearful of turning up the volume beyond 12 or 1
o'clock. There often is life beyond 1 o'clock with lots of equipment.

If your volume control is at 5 o'clock or you hear gross distortion, then
you should find a place too hook your phones up that has more output. One
such place is the output of your power amp, and another would be the output
of some kind of booster amp. With either, ear damage or headphone damage is
a possibility.

Perhaps you don't like the basic tone quality of the HD600s. Then, your
options are equalization or simply getting different headphones.

>> In other cases the headphone is driven by some resistors tapped off
>> of output circuitry that is designed for other purposes. One
>> commonly finds this in receivers and integrated amplifiers, but also
>> sometimes in devices that have just line output jacks. In most
>> cases, you want to use an external headphone amp with headphone
>> jacks implemented with resistive taps.

> Most CD players have headphone jacks and they also offer level
> control and some gain. My Marantz ("Professional") 331 is one such
> player. How would you suggest I might get the better sound; driving
> amplifiers from its headphone jack or from one of its "fixed" line
> outs?

Please see my former comments.

[Norman Schwartz]

Volume is not a problem, in any way whatsoever, I can produce the entire
volume range from silence to more than too loud (without distortion) at
customary and normal settings . I don't have schematics of the preamp, CD
player(s) or the Creek headphone amp and even if I did I wouldn't be able to
interpret their significance to the issue at hand. Of course one can listen
to a bunch of recordings and then decide for yourself. However there could
well be situations not afforded for by the test comparisons. Therefore it is
advantageous to be profit from the experience of others (hence my question).
I conclude that just as is the case with many other things in life, one will
never know.

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
>
> > "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> "Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
> >> . net
> >>> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> >>> ...
> >>>>> headphones.
> >>>>
> >>>> Maybe it would be good to consider the technical differences
> >>>> between the headphone jack on a piece of equipment that is designed
> >>>> primarily for use with headphones, and those on a headphone amp,
> >>>> which is after all a piece of equipment that is designed primarily
> >>>> for use with headphones.
>
> >> There are two different ways that headphone jacks are driven from the
> >> circuitry in audio gear. In some cases there is a dedicated headphone
> >> amplifier, whose quality may vary. If you get a good implementation
> >> of this, then using an external amp could be a waste. One finds this
> >> sort of thing in equipment that is designed to drive headphones as
> >> the primary output, but one also finds it in components like
> >> recorders and players that are used for audio production or home
> >> multimedia or hifi.
>
> > One of my pre-amps (Adcom 565) has a headphone jack. I also have a
> > Creek OBH-11SE headphone amp. Where would you suggest I might get the
> > better quality sound from a Sennheiser HD600?
>
> Not having the schematic diagrams or actual equipment for either device at
> my disposal, I have no serious advice. However, if you think that your
> headphones don't play loud enough suit you, you should try turning up the
> volume. I don't mean this as an insult, because I have become aware of the
> fact that some people are fearful of turning up the volume beyond 12 or 1
> o'clock. There often is life beyond 1 o'clock with lots of equipment.
>
> If your volume control is at 5 o'clock or you hear gross distortion, then
> you should find a place too hook your phones up that has more output. One
> such place is the output of your power amp, and another would be the
output
> of some kind of booster amp. With either, ear damage or headphone damage
is
> a possibility.
>
> Perhaps you don't like the basic tone quality of the HD600s. Then, your
> options are equalization or simply getting different headphones.
>
> >> In other cases the headphone is driven by some resistors tapped off
> >> of output circuitry that is designed for other purposes. One
> >> commonly finds this in receivers and integrated amplifiers, but also
> >> sometimes in devices that have just line output jacks. In most
> >> cases, you want to use an external headphone amp with headphone
> >> jacks implemented with resistive taps.
>
> > Most CD players have headphone jacks and they also offer level
> > control and some gain. My Marantz ("Professional") 331 is one such
> > player. How would you suggest I might get the better sound; driving
> > amplifiers from its headphone jack or from one of its "fixed" line
> > outs?
>
> Please see my former comments.
>
>
>
>

[Arny Krueger]

"Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
et

> Volume is not a problem, in any way whatsoever, I can produce the
> entire volume range from silence to more than too loud (without
> distortion) at customary and normal settings . I don't have
> schematics of the preamp, CD player(s) or the Creek headphone amp and
> even if I did I wouldn't be able to interpret their significance to
> the issue at hand.

....well you asked me....

> Of course one can listen to a bunch of recordings
> and then decide for yourself.

Now there's an idea.

My understanding is that the way this issue often comes up is that someone
says something like: I'm going to buy some HD580 phones, and someone else
says: Well if you do that, you're going to have to buy a good headphone
amp. I don't have any problem with the suggestion that there may be an
exposure to wanting a headphone amp for a number of technical and
non-technical reasons. But I do have a problem with stating it as a global
requirement.

[Norman Schwartz]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
> et
>
> > Volume is not a problem, in any way whatsoever, I can produce the
> > entire volume range from silence to more than too loud (without
> > distortion) at customary and normal settings . I don't have
> > schematics of the preamp, CD player(s) or the Creek headphone amp and
> > even if I did I wouldn't be able to interpret their significance to
> > the issue at hand.
>
> ...well you asked me....
>
> > Of course one can listen to a bunch of recordings
> > and then decide for yourself.
>
> Now there's an idea.
>
> My understanding is that the way this issue often comes up is that someone
> says something like: I'm going to buy some HD580 phones, and someone else
> says: Well if you do that, you're going to have to buy a good headphone
> amp. I don't have any problem with the suggestion that there may be an
> exposure to wanting a headphone amp for a number of technical and
> non-technical reasons. But I do have a problem with stating it as a global
> requirement.
>
All of the above could well be the case, however for the cost of a 580 or
600 *plus* a more durable headphone cable *AND* a good headphone amp (should
you encounter its need) I recommend buying the Stax SRS-3030 Classic System
II (from audiocubes.com) for both lower cost and far better sound.

[Arny Krueger]

"Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> ...
> > "Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message
> > et
> >
> > > Volume is not a problem, in any way whatsoever, I can produce the
> > > entire volume range from silence to more than too loud (without
> > > distortion) at customary and normal settings . I don't have
> > > schematics of the preamp, CD player(s) or the Creek headphone amp and
> > > even if I did I wouldn't be able to interpret their significance to
> > > the issue at hand.
> >
> > ...well you asked me....
> >
> > > Of course one can listen to a bunch of recordings
> > > and then decide for yourself.
> >
> > Now there's an idea.
> >
> > My understanding is that the way this issue often comes up is that
someone
> > says something like: I'm going to buy some HD580 phones, and someone
else
> > says: Well if you do that, you're going to have to buy a good headphone
> > amp. I don't have any problem with the suggestion that there may be an
> > exposure to wanting a headphone amp for a number of technical and
> > non-technical reasons. But I do have a problem with stating it as a
global
> > requirement.
> >
> All of the above could well be the case, however for the cost of a 580 or
> 600 *plus* a more durable headphone cable *AND* a good headphone amp
(should
> you encounter its need) I recommend buying the Stax SRS-3030 Classic
System
> II (from audiocubes.com) for both lower cost and far better sound.

I did a little research and came up with the following:

Radio Shack part number 330-1109 3-Way Headphone Volume Booster. This
device runs off of 2 AA cells and provides 3 amplifier headphone jacks. I
ran some measurements on it and find that it has approximately 6 dB gain,
0.003% THD @ 1 KHz full output, approximately 90 dB SNR and frequency
response 20-20 KHz +0, - 0.3 dB. It sells for the princely sum of $22.95.

HD 580s routinely sell for $199, and can often be had for at least $25 less
than that. I've had my HD580s for a year and a half, use them several hours
daily and the headphone cable is still going strong. If you buy wisely, and
need more output than the headphone jack at hand will provide, you can get
the 580s, the 330-1109, and change from $200 (which is much less than $779).

http://www.audiocubes.com/product_info.php?products_id=129

[Norman Schwartz]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> I did a little research and came up with the following:
>
> Radio Shack part number 330-1109 3-Way Headphone Volume Booster. This
> device runs off of 2 AA cells and provides 3 amplifier headphone jacks. I
> ran some measurements on it and find that it has approximately 6 dB gain,
> 0.003% THD @ 1 KHz full output, approximately 90 dB SNR and frequency
> response 20-20 KHz +0, - 0.3 dB. It sells for the princely sum of $22.95.
>

IME the best thing concerning the purchase of any Radio Shack branded
product is its no questions asked money back guarantee. (However with the
cost of gas these days it may not turn out to be a good thing at all.)

[Arny Krueger]

"Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message


> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I did a little research and came up with the following:

>> Radio Shack part number 330-1109 3-Way Headphone Volume Booster. This
>> device runs off of 2 AA cells and provides 3 amplifier headphone
>> jacks. I ran some measurements on it and find that it has
>> approximately 6 dB gain,
>> 0.003% THD @ 1 KHz full output, approximately 90 dB SNR and frequency
>> response 20-20 KHz +0, - 0.3 dB. It sells for the princely sum of
>> $22.95.


> IME the best thing concerning the purchase of any Radio Shack branded
> product is its no questions asked money back guarantee. (However with
> the cost of gas these days it may not turn out to be a good thing at
> all.)

If you actually heard the 330-1109, which appears to be a black-cased clone
of a product known as the "Boostaroo", you might give it a little more
credit than that. I'm thinking that a couple of dowel-based battery
simulators could mate it to a 6 volt DC wall wart for something with even
more punch.

BTW, RS does mail order.

http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=&p
roduct%5Fid=33%2D1109

In my ongoing search for quality personal listening devices, I just picked
up a pair of Shure E2's which I am investigating as an alternative to Sony
MDR-EX-70/71 earbuds.

MDR EX-71 are 16 ohms with 100 dB/mW sensitivity. Strong bass and strong,
rough treble but tolerable to my ears with smooth source material. Some
would say too just too much treble. Street price $40-50

Shure E2 are 16 ohms with 105 dB/mW sensitivity. Less bass and treble, but
smoother-sounding to my ears. Street price $80-90

[Norman Schwartz]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
>
> BTW, RS does mail order.
>
>
http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=&p

How about refunding of shipping charges (forward and reverse)? (The Sony
parts dept. does!)
In listening to a batch of recordings for evaluation of headphones/headphone
amps, there is a good possibility that a unforeseen (untested) situation
will arise e.g.; all ranges of male a female (solo) voices, choruses, organ,
etc. etc. Additionally you will get no sense whatsoever regarding long term
satisfaction with *any* snap judgment. As for the durability of the
Sennheiser cords, even they know that their product has a serious problem
and will only allow for one cord during the one year warranty period. (I
already have mine.) Reports of broken Sennheiser headphone cords were and
remain commonplace.

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&th=513c3a2bd2399727&rnum=4

My Sennheiser cord became intermittent with 6 months. I suppose you were
extremely lucky with yours.

As for the cost of a good Sennheiser set-up from Headroom: the 600 is $279,
a Creek OB-11SE ($349) and a Cardas cord which eliminates the cord problem
only at the plug end, $150, grand total, $778. If you wish to get the 580
instead, figure a $80 saving. IMO the Stax 3030 system being available for
only a single buck more, one would be foolish to go the Sennheiser route.
Regardless of cost, and more importantly how would you compare fit comfort
and sound quality?

[Arny Krueger]

"Norman Schwartz" > wrote in message


> "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> ...

>> BTW, RS does mail order.

>
http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=&p

> How about refunding of shipping charges (forward and reverse)? (The
> Sony parts dept. does!)

For Sony's prices they'd better...

> In listening to a batch of recordings for evaluation of
> headphones/headphone amps, there is a good possibility that a
> unforeseen (untested) situation will arise e.g.; all ranges of male
> a female (solo) voices, choruses, organ, etc. etc.

Given that you've not tested the recommend alternative at all, that would be
your problem not mine.

> Additionally you
> will get no sense whatsoever regarding long term satisfaction with
> *any* snap judgment.

Given that you've not tested the recommend alternative at all, that would be
your problem not mine.

> As for the durability of the Sennheiser cords,
> even they know that their product has a serious problem and will only
> allow for one cord during the one year warranty period. (I already
> have mine.) Reports of broken Sennheiser headphone cords were and
> remain commonplace.
>
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&th=513c3a2bd2399
727&rnum=4

So what? Last time I looked replacements are under $20 at the Sennheiser web
site. The replacement procedure is plug and play. Now let's look at the cost
of replacing the cords on competitive Sony headphones, or for that matter,
headphones from just about anybody else.

I'm sure that there are lots of people who have abused their equipment and
don't want to take responsibility for the consequences. I broke my 580s
early on, but I admit it, I stepped on them. It cost me under $50 to fix
them, and that was that.

> My Sennheiser cord became intermittent with 6 months. I suppose you
> were extremely lucky with yours.

So what? Lat time I looked, replacements were under $20 at the Sennheiser
web site. The replacement procedure is plug and play.

> As for the cost of a good Sennheiser set-up from Headroom: the 600 is
> $279,

If you're inclined to waste your money like that when you can get 580s some
place else for nearly $100 less.

>a Creek OB-11SE ($349)

Unnecessary,

> and a Cardas cord which eliminates the
> cord problem only at the plug end, $150,

Unnecessary, if you need a spare on hand, get one from the Sennheiser web
site cheap.

> grand total, $778.

Hey, perchance you were manager of $900 hammer for the Navy? This must be
how they did it!

> If you wish to get the 580 instead, figure a $80 saving.

If you want to use your brain, figure a $600 saving.

> IMO the Stax 3030
> system being available for only a single buck more, one would be
> foolish to go the Sennheiser route.

....if you buy this claim, I've got a bridge across the Detroit river I'd
like to sell you...

> Regardless of cost, and more
> importantly how would you compare fit comfort and sound quality?

First thing I did is look at the facts and dismiss the bogus logic and
accounting.